'We are living through the darkest chapter of American history,' Trump's campaign stated in a fundraising email
https://www.npr.org/live-updates/donald-trump-indictment-arrest-new-york
Previous discussion:
PRES. TRUMP GONNA GET ARRESTED?
35 responses |
Started by 12345 - March 18, 2023, 2:42 p.m.
Republicans going haywire...........and they haven't even seen the indictment.
It actually doesn't matter what Trump did and how guilty he is.
Seriously, that does not matter because in a cult, you don't use reasoning or critical thinking you just BELIEVE and FOLLOW!
Trump is holding the GOP back
Started by metmike - Oct. 12, 2022, 1:32 p.m.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iTACH1eVIaA
++++++++++
Trump knows this and continues to play his tens of millions of captured brains like a fiddle.
Let's see what's in the indictment before commenting.
For some strange reason, I'm thinking that it will show Trump breaking numerous laws based on legit evidence. ....but let's wait and see.
LOL WHAT A HORRID COUNTRY THIS ONCE GREAT NATION IS TURNING INTO.
THE FLORIDA GOV. WON'T GO ALONG WITH AN EXTRADITION
BECK CAN GET MORE THAN A TAD ON THE RADICAL SIDE, AT TIMES, BUT... I AGREE WITH HIM 100%+ ON THIS. I'VE BEEN SAYIN' BASICALLY THE SAME THING SINCE 2015.
CALL ME A CONSPIRACY WHACKO OR CULT MEMBER, IF'N YA WANT. THAT'S OKAY! LOL
Glenn Beck issues grave warning to America after Trump indictment
I mostly agree with him on much of his, Jean.
Trump was toast in my opinion and the dems knew that DeSantis was the legit candidate
and Biden's chances of running again are in the single digits, let alone being elected, which is near 0 right now.
I think they have the goods on Trump but they absolutely knew it would generate this reaction from the Rs.
This is there chance to use that extreme reaction against them.
R's clinging to and supporting the 1 person that has damaged his own party more than any person in history and helping their "NOT Donald Trump" candidates.
They Rs are totally playing into this game plan and making fools out of the party defending a criminal scum bag that betrayed our country/Constitution and abused his presidential power to try to over turn a presidential election that he lost and being the entire motivator for the Insurrection.
Instead of letting Rs discard this massive party ruining, deranged, lying psychopath, the Ds have set up a situation for them to see Trump, absurdly as a victim so he can help wreck the R party even more.
Beck sees this.
All those other predictions? I agree strongly with them. Maybe not exact details but the US's actions in Ukraine, forcing an alliance between, Russia, China, Syria, Iran and possibly others, like Brazil based on US/NATO total propaganda of the most retarded, counterproductive war in US history, including Vietnam is leading to unavoidable consequences. And consequences that were always predictable.
I'm just a 27 year yahoo chess coach from Indiana but understand the concepts with these war games and their unavoidable consequences when you take the path that Biden has.
And it will get MUCH worse unless Biden calls for peace ASAP. Instead, we only get rhetoric about no negotiations, just defeating Putin on the battlefied with US weapons and the US/NATO psychopath puppet obliterating his country and killing his people for NATO fame.
Totally preventable if Biden had just agreed with Putin to not bring Ukraine into the control and protection of NATO, which is really just the United States promising to protect all those countries.
He can still stop it from getting MUCH worse but needs to do an immediate about face.
The problem is that the false war propaganda fed to Americans has worked so well that they support his actions.
If Americans changed their tunes and broke out of the brainwash with critical thinking about the war with no benefits and nothing but trillions of times more consequences..........and stopped supporting Biden........that's the main reason for him to start acting with common sense.
https://www.marketforum.com/forum/topic/94205/
And they're trying to destroy our wonderful energy delivery system that features cheap, reliable and power dense fossil fuels that serve as their own battery.
All because of a slight increase in global temperature and exaggerated catastrophes like the oceans going up at just over an inch/decade......during the current scientific optimum for life. Not an optimum despite climate change and increasing CO2 but climate change and beneficial CO2 are actually CAUSING the climate optimum for most life, including humans growing crops.
There's that propaganda thing again. When it works.......nothing else matters, including the truth and authentic science.
More high end flooding events? Yes, 7% more moisture
More drought? NO!
Benefits will still greatly outweigh negatives for the next decade.
After that, could it go the other way?
Yes but there is a technology developed already that can precipitate all the carbon out of emission streams at an extremely low cost.
I know, my wife is involved in the devices doing it right now. Not theoretical but DOING IT!
This will make retarded carbon sequestration, crony capitalism carbon removal schemes obsolete.
You hook these up to fossil fuel power plants and they break bonds in the CO2 emissions and convert all the CO2 into solid carbon and beneficial O2.
US Climate Is Getting LessExtreme, Not More
22 responses |
Started by metmike - Jan. 13, 2023, 12:37 p.m.
BIDEN WILL "PULL A RABBIT" OUT OF HIS *** WHEN IT GETS CLOSER TO THE ELECTION & WILL CHOOSE THE "SMARTEST MAN HE KNOWS" TO BE HIS RUNNING MATE.
WHAT A WINNER OF A TICKET THAT'LL BE, EH????? HAHAHAHAHAAAAAAA
WHAT FUNNNNNNNNN
WE don't know what's in the indictment...........but this guy, Lanny Davis knows much of it and sounds extremely credible, though having reason to be biased.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aV8J2hgCoro
He says that Republicans trying to trash Cohen's credibility are completely missing the big picture.
According to him, every iota of what Cohen is testifying to is backed up by data, bank receipts and other solid evidence. Documentation from multiple sources featuring text messages, telephone calls and witnesses that can't be disputed and took years to accumulate in order to get to where we are today in this case against Donald Trump.
To an open and objective mind using critical thinking.........he makes 100% sense
That won't compute to far right brains that don't care about data, evidence or documents because they already decided Trump is an innocent victim... something they concluded years ago, before this case even came up.
However in the authentic legal world, the one that this prosecutor practices in, that's what they use to convict guilty people.
He also discusses Karen McDougle too as another independent crime that Cohen pled guilty to representing Donald Trump related to campaign finance violations in order to influence elections which makes it a federal crime.
I agree with Jean here. It is innocent until proven guilty as we all know. Thus, Nancy made a terrible Twitter post in saying the Trump side has to prove his innocence:
Thanks Larry and Jean!
Great points.
We'll just have to see what the evidence shows. I admit to being biased...........from knowing Trump and reading/hearing discussions like the one in the previous post.
However, authentically recognizing ones own bias is the best way to adjust our mindsets to consciously force objective thinking based on giving greater weight to facts in order to discard emotions.
I'm sure that's exactly what Larry is doing.
He greatly despises Trump but has consistently applied the scientific method to most of his thinking, especially when it comes to facts, data, evidence and always with science.
+++++++++++++++
This cuts both ways too.
Everybody insisting that this is purely political and it's "trumped up" charges that would never be filed if it wasn't Trump in order to keep him from being elected IS doing the exact same thing as they accuse the other side of doing.
They are attacking the prosecutor (and attacking Cohen) as being guilty of singling out/targeting Donald Trump before they've even presented the case.
I've already read dozens of stories trashing this prosecutor in a way never witnessed in my memory before and all before anybody has seen the facts/indictment.
So why don't we get those facts and share what's been learned right now.
+++++++++++++++++++
HOW WAS BRAGG INVOLVED WITH THE TRUMP INDICTMENT?
Bragg inherited a yearslong grand jury investigation into hush money paid on Trump’s behalf during his 2016 presidential campaign.
After taking office, Bragg slowed down his office’s move toward an indictment against Trump and said he had concerns about the strength of the case. That sparked a public protest by two prosecutors who were leading the investigation and resigned.
MORE: New York grand jury indicts Trump in hush-money case, lawyer says
But Bragg convened a new grand jury early this year after successfully convicting Trump’s family company for tax fraud. He called that result a “strong demarcation line” for proceeding with other parts of the probe.
In general, the grand jury process is seen as extremely favorable to prosecutors.
Proceedings are closed to the public and there is no judge. Prosecutors call and question witnesses and grand jurors — people drawn from the community — can ask questions. Grand jurors can either agree there is enough evidence to issue an indictment, find there is not enough evidence or tell the prosecutor to file lesser charges.
++++++++++
This would suggest that Bragg is not at all what is being described by republicans, an outlier pushing this case on his own to get trump, despite being contradicted.
I fact checked the above information and it was solidly confirmed below:
Mark F. Pomerantz, who had investigated the former president, left after the Manhattan district attorney, Alvin Bragg, halted an effort to seek an indictment.
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/03/23/nyregion/trump-investigation-felony-resignation-pomerantz.html
One of the senior Manhattan prosecutors who investigated Donald J. Trump believed that the former president was “guilty of numerous felony violations” and that it was “a grave failure of justice” not to hold him accountable, according to a copy of his resignation letter.
The prosecutor, Mark F. Pomerantz, submitted his resignation last month after the Manhattan district attorney, Alvin Bragg, abruptly stopped pursuing an indictment of Mr. Trump.
Mr. Pomerantz, 70, a prominent former federal prosecutor and white-collar defense lawyer who came out of retirement to work on the Trump investigation, resigned on the same day as Carey R. Dunne, another senior prosecutor leading the inquiry.
Mr. Pomerantz’s Feb. 23 letter, obtained by The New York Times, offers a personal account of his decision to resign and for the first time states explicitly his belief that the office could have convicted the former president. Mr. Bragg’s decision was “contrary to the public interest,” he wrote.
“The team that has been investigating Mr. Trump harbors no doubt about whether he committed crimes — he did,” Mr. Pomerantz wrote.
Mr. Pomerantz and Mr. Dunne planned to charge Mr. Trump with falsifying business records, specifically his annual financial statements — a felony in New York State.
Mr. Bragg’s decision not to pursue charges then — and the resignations that followed — threw the fate of the long-running investigation into serious doubt. If the prosecutors had secured an indictment of Mr. Trump, it would have been the highest-profile case ever brought by the Manhattan district attorney’s office and would have made Mr. Trump the first American president to face criminal charges.
Earlier this month, The Times reported that the investigation unraveled after weeks of escalating disagreement between the veteran prosecutors overseeing the case and the new district attorney. Much of the debate centered on whether the prosecutors could prove that Mr. Trump knowingly falsified the value of his assets on annual financial statements, The Times found, a necessary element to proving the case.
While Mr. Dunne and Mr. Pomerantz were confident that the office could demonstrate that the former president had intended to inflate the value of his golf clubs, hotels and office buildings, Mr. Bragg was not. He balked at pursuing an indictment against Mr. Trump, a decision that shut down Mr. Pomerantz’s and Mr. Dunne’s presentation of evidence to a grand jury and prompted their resignations.
Mr. Bragg has said that his office continues to conduct the investigation. For that reason, Mr. Bragg, a former federal prosecutor and deputy New York State attorney general who became district attorney in January, is barred from commenting on its specifics.
Mr. Bragg’s predecessor, Cyrus R. Vance Jr., had decided in his final days in office to move toward an indictment, leaving Mr. Trump just weeks away from likely criminal charges. Mr. Bragg’s decision seems, for now at least, to have removed one of the greatest legal threats Mr. Trump has ever faced.
The resignation letter cast a harsh light on that decision from the perspective of Mr. Pomerantz, who wrote that he believed there was enough evidence to prove Mr. Trump’s guilt “beyond a reasonable doubt.”
“No case is perfect,” Mr. Pomerantz wrote. “Whatever the risks of bringing the case may be, I am convinced that a failure to prosecute will pose much greater risks in terms of public confidence in the fair administration of justice.”
In a statement responding to the letter, Mr. Trump’s lawyer, Ronald P. Fischetti, said that charges were not warranted and that Mr. Pomerantz “had the opportunity to present the fruits of his investigation to the D.A. and his senior staff on several occasions and failed.”
Mr. Fischetti, who was Mr. Pomerantz’s law partner in the 1980s and early 1990s, added: “We should applaud District Attorney Alvin Bragg for adhering to the rule of law and sticking to the evidence while making an apolitical charging decision based solely on the lack of evidence and nothing else.”
In its own statement, Mr. Trump’s company, the Trump Organization, called Mr. Pomerantz “a never-Trumper” and said: “Never before have we seen this level of corruption in our legal system.”
Mr. Trump has long denied wrongdoing and leveled personal attacks on the people investigating him, including a thinly veiled reference to Mr. Pomerantz. In one statement, he claimed that lawyers from Mr. Pomerantz’s former law firm had “gone to work in the district attorney’s office in order to viciously make sure that ‘the job gets done.’ ”
Mr. Pomerantz, who confirmed his resignation in a brief interview last month, declined to comment on the letter when contacted by The Times this week.
A spokeswoman for Mr. Bragg, Danielle Filson, said that the investigation was continuing and added: “A team of experienced prosecutors is working every day to follow the facts and the law. There is nothing more we can or should say at this juncture about an ongoing investigation.”
In his letter, Mr. Pomerantz acknowledged that Mr. Bragg “devoted significant time and energy to understanding the evidence” in the inquiry and had made his decision in good faith. But, he wrote, “a decision made in good faith may nevertheless be wrong.”
Mr. Pomerantz contrasted Mr. Bragg’s approach with that of Mr. Vance, who made the Trump investigation a centerpiece of his tenure and convened the grand jury last fall. Mr. Pomerantz’s letter said that shortly before leaving office, Mr. Vance had directed the prosecutors to pursue an indictment of Mr. Trump as well as “other defendants as soon as reasonably possible.”
The letter did not name the other defendants, but the recent Times article reported that the prosecutors envisioned also charging Mr. Trump’s family business and his longtime chief financial officer, Allen H. Weisselberg, who had already been indicted along with the company last year, accused of a yearslong scheme to evade taxes.
Mr. Bragg has told aides that the inquiry could move forward if a new piece of evidence is unearthed, or if a Trump Organization insider decides to turn on Mr. Trump. Some investigators in the office saw either possibility as highly unlikely.
“There are always additional facts to be pursued,” Mr. Pomerantz wrote in his letter. “But the investigative team that has been working on this matter for many months does not believe that it makes law enforcement sense to postpone a prosecution in the hope that additional evidence will somehow emerge.”
He added that “I and others believe that your decision not to authorize prosecution now will doom any future prospects that Mr. Trump will be prosecuted for the criminal conduct we have been investigating.”
As of late December, the team investigating Mr. Trump was mostly united around Mr. Vance’s decision to pursue charges — but that had not always been the case, The Times reported this month. Last year, three career prosecutors in the district attorney’s office opted to leave the team, uncomfortable with the speed at which it was proceeding and with what they believed were gaps in the evidence.
Initially, Mr. Pomerantz and Mr. Dunne had envisioned charging Mr. Trump with the crime of “scheme to defraud,” believing that he falsely inflated his assets on the statements of financial condition that had been used to obtain bank loans. But by the end of the year, they had changed course and planned to charge Mr. Trump with falsifying business records — a simpler case that essentially amounted to painting Mr. Trump as a liar rather than a thief.
Mr. Pomerantz, who joined the investigation more than a year ago, said in the letter that Mr. Trump’s financial statements were “false” — that he had lied about his assets to “banks, the national media, counterparties, and many others, including the American people.”
Mr. Pomerantz is not the only one involved in the investigation to suggest that Mr. Trump or his company broke the law. The New York attorney general, Letitia James, whose office is assisting the criminal investigation and conducting its own civil inquiry, has filed court papers in the civil matter arguing that she has evidence showing that the Trump Organization had engaged in “fraudulent or misleading” practices.
Mr. Trump has accused Mr. Bragg and Ms. James, both of whom are Black Democrats, of carrying out a politically motivated “witch hunt” and being “racists.”
Ms. James’s inquiry, which can lead to a lawsuit but not criminal charges, continues as she seeks to question Mr. Trump and two of his adult children under oath. The Trumps recently appealed a judge’s order that they submit to Ms. James’s questioning.
In another court filing, Ms. James disclosed that Mr. Trump’s longtime accounting firm, Mazars USA, had cut ties with him and essentially retracted a decade’s worth of his financial statements.
Mazars was shaping up to be a crucial witness in the criminal investigation as well. In January, Mr. Pomerantz questioned Mr. Trump’s accountant at Mazars before the grand jury, zeroing in on exaggerations in the financial statements.
But the statements also contained disclaimers, including acknowledgments that Mazars had neither audited nor authenticated Mr. Trump’s claims, potentially complicating the case. And some of Mr. Bragg’s supporters have argued that it would have been a difficult case to win.
Still, Mr. Pomerantz wrote that he and other prosecutors believed that they had amassed sufficient evidence to establish the former president’s guilt, writing that, “We believe that the prosecution would prevail if charges were brought and the matter were tried to an impartial jury.”
Addressing an apparent belief in Mr. Bragg’s office that they might lose at trial, Mr. Pomerantz wrote, “Respect for the rule of law, and the need to reinforce the bedrock proposition that ‘no man is above the law,’ require that this prosecution be brought even if a conviction is not certain.”
Mr. Pomerantz is a former head of the criminal division in the United States attorney’s office in Manhattan, as well as a longtime defense lawyer. He worked on the Trump investigation pro bono.
Mr. Dunne at the time was serving as Mr. Vance’s general counsel, a job he had held since early 2017. In that role, he had successfully argued before the Supreme Court, winning access to Mr. Trump’s tax records.
Mr. Dunne has declined to comment.
+++++++++++++++++
To me, this is extremely profound but again, we need to see the actual indictment and evidence.
What I can say with absolute certainty is that these prosecutors, with decades of experience would not be putting their careers on the line(even resigning) and stating, what completely makes sense that its for an ethical justice system principle(that they sincerely believe in and worked for their entire lives) ....not just a ruse to "get" Donald Trump for political reasons.
What the evidence shows is that Alvin Bragg, knowing the backlash and challenges because this is Donald Trump, was initially very apprehensive. The polar opposite of being GUNG HO out for Trump because of politics as he's being falsely accused of.
This pretty much DEBUNKS the accusations of Bragg doing it as some outlier, far left prosecutor trying to take down Trump.
Bragg is certainly getting his reputation trashed here and we haven't seen anything yet!
https://www.cnn.com/2023/03/31/politics/trump-soros-bragg-color-of-change/index.html
I started reading this article assuming that it would provide the facts to prove Trump's claims were just another loony conspiracy theory.
CNN did their best to try to convince readings of what I was expecting but instead they convinced me of the opposite. While Trump may be stretching the significance a bit with his assertions, the facts actually strongly back him up and CNN was actually the one doing the misleading in this article.
Their own facts busted themselves.
All you have to do is ignore their biased, misleading interpretation and use common sense.
"The Color of Change PAC, which has backed progressive district attorney candidates around the country, spent slightly over $500,000 supporting Bragg
Soros was the PAC’s biggest donor in the 2021-2022 period, PolitiFact has reported."
"As PolitiFact has noted, Soros’s son, Jonathan Soros, and Jonathan’s wife, Jennifer Allan Soros, each made $10,000 donations to Bragg’s campaign during the Democratic primary in April 2021. They had made smaller donations, totaling $450, earlier in the year."
And we're supposed to believe that Bragg wasn't backed by Soros????
Robinson said that attacks suggesting Bragg is a puppet of Soros, because of George Soros’s donations to the Color of Change PAC, are not only “antisemitic” but also “anti-Black.”
Hugh? You have to do backflips to use race and nationality discrimination in this inappropriate interpretation.
CNN's article defending Bragg just made me suspicious of him.
He may be a totally honest, independent guy but CNN's attempt to treat me like an idiot, as if I can't think and see the obvious that they are pretending has no meaning, makes me feel like they're trying to cover up something.
Robinson said that attacks suggesting Bragg is a puppet of Soros, because of George Soros’s donations to the Color of Change PAC, are not only “antisemitic” but also “anti-Black.”
--------------
Hey Mike,
The antisemitic accusation is based on some GOP members for years repeatedly citing Soros as the equivalent of a puppeteer.
You may want to read the info here to get a better idea of what the concern is:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Soros_conspiracy_theories
From that:
Hungarian-American billionaire businessman and philanthropist George Soros has been described as "the perfect code word" for conspiracy theories that unite antisemitism and Islamophobia. One prominent Soros-related conspiracy theory is that he is behind the European migrant crisis or importing migrants to European countries.
What do you think? Is there any chance CNN has a point worth considering? I don't agree with many of Soros' positions as I feel he's way to the left of me, but that's beside the point I'm trying to bring up here. Being that I don't agree with him much on issues is not the same thing as feeling he is a controlling puppeteer like the MAGAs want you to believe.
Hey Mike,
This article may be worth reading in regard to Soros' association with Bragg:
https://www.cnbc.com/amp/2023/03/22/trump-indictment-alvin-bragg-ties-to-george-soros-examined.html
Thanksmuch, Larry,
im doing much more detective work on Soros before commenting.
considering the massive amounts he gave to organizations that support Bragg AND his son AND his daughter in law both contributed the max allowed by the law directly to Bragg, I think the Soros angle has legs.
the statements that Soros was never in direct contact with Bragg, supposedly meaning no influence are an insult to thinking peoples intelligence.
more later!
need more time to gather Soros data and am tied up for awhile but didn’t realize the extent of Soros contributions…..tens of billions to his causes, until now.
sadly, this just takes away from whether trump is guilty or not But it’s clear evidence that politics played at least a very big role, if not the biggest role in deciding to file the charges.
I hate it when people try to drag in race or nationality into situations like this to misxharacterize and smear one side.
As admitted, I'm biased and think that Trump is guilty but will look at the evidence to really decide.
However, I'm now convinced that this is political too based on the provable facts/evidence.
George Soros only donates to candidates that favor his progressive, often far left agenda. In the case of this prosecutor, you have him donating half a billion to an organization that supports Bragg but the smoking gun is that his son and daughter in law donated the max amount allowed to Bragg.
That couldn't be unless Bragg is far left.
a far left person can never not be seen as political in a case against a far right guy. the soros family knows this and would not have donated so much money if not for Bragg being far left.
the resignation of the others could have been totally staged, especially the way that it played out to cause people like me to think what I did initially….and form assumptions that trump facts from that point on.
Bragg is the worst person possible to be trying this case .
but they MUST know this which makes me suspect they are intentionally causing the Rs to have bad behavior and a revival of the guy killing their party.
Every story on Soros and his family from the left about the right accusing Soros of trying to use his money and power to meddle in US politics claims that the right is making up conspiracy theories.
Or that its anti Semitic.
The evidence proves indisputably otherwise.
Soros senior is now 92 years old and has passed on many of his duties to his children, who continue his legacy of having a high impact in global and US politics by manipulating people and government policies with his money. I consider this to be extraordinarily unethical. Legal, yes just like much of the lobby money is just legal bribing of politicians, giving very rich people many 1,000's of times more power than poor people that only get 1 vote.
George Soros is ranked #1 with his donations.
Alex Soros, son of billionaire megadonor and philanthropist George Soros, has quietly had a pipeline to the Biden White House as he openly mingles with high-profile Democratic politicians and showers liberal causes with millions in cash.
While the elder Soros has often kept a lower profile while exerting influence through direct political donations and funding of left-wing causes from his big-money nonprofit network, the younger Soros has openly bragged about his cozying up with politicians and world leaders.
According to a Fox News Digital review of visitor logs, Alex has visited the White House six times since Biden took office. The visits span from October 2021 to December 2022 and include meetings with the upper echelon of the Biden administration.
A White House official confirmed to Fox News Digital that two of the visits were with Ron Klain, Biden's chief of staff. In addition to the meetings that appear in the visitor logs, Alex was also on the guest list for the lavish state dinner honoring French President Emmanuel Macron and his wife, Brigitte.
May 9, 2022
https://campaignlegal.org/update/what-dark-money
September 15, 2022
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/soros-distances-himself-manhattan-da-bragg-trump-indictment
"As for Alvin Bragg, as a matter of fact I did not contribute to his campaign and I don't know him," Soros told Semafor. "I think some on the right would rather focus on far-fetched conspiracy theories than on the serious charges against the former president."
+++++++++++++
You can make a case that some of Soros money goes to good causes and it's his money to do what he wants to, including establishing himself (and his family) as the undisputed king of exploiting the legal bribery rules of US politics. However, his comment above, is very dishonest/misleading and quite frankly, laughable. But he knows the media will defend that response and protect him by attacking those revealing the truth about him.
"On May 8, 2021, Color of Change PAC endorsed Bragg and pledged to shell out $1 million to boost him through voter turnout initiatives, campaigning, and direct mailers, records show.
Six days later, on May 14, 2021, Soros steered $1 million to Color of Change PAC, which has repeatedly supported defunding the police and endorsed the likes of "Squad" Democrats Rashida Tlaib (D-MI) and Ilhan Omar (D-MN). The $1 million "intended to help Mr. Bragg with the money," according to the New York Times.
Color of Change ended up pulling $500,000 from its Bragg pledge due to an anonymous woman's allegation against the then-candidate, the Daily Mail reported. The allegation hasn't been publicized, and the outlet did not learn of its contents.
While Soros indirectly supported Bragg's candidacy, his family did so directly. Jonathan Soros, the son of George Soros, contributed $10,000 in April 2021 to Bragg's campaign, records show. Bragg also pocketed $10,000 in campaign money from Jennifer Allan Soros, Jonathan's wife, in April 2021."
The saddest thing of all in this is the fact that the republicans actually have a very legit case claiming that a far left guy, backed by George Soros is behind this.
They are right.
I would bet anything that Alvin Bragg has the goods on Trump with numerous times the evidence to nail anybody else.
However, there is no denying the real world far left politics of Alvin Bragg and Soros money greatly assisting him getting elected.
Again, I will wait to see what the indictment shows but even if it shows what I strongly suspect it does.........this is the wrong far left guy to be prosecuting far right Trump if you want to present the prosecutor as being objectively credible.
This IS extremely important in trying the case.
If you remember, OJ Simpson got away with murder, basically because they destroyed the credibility of Mark Ferdman in proving that he used the N word.
The jury saw him as a racist and biased against OJ and disregarded his rock solid, very credible evidence because of this.
I can't imagine that Trump's lawyers wouldn't be able to destroy Bragg in the same way.........a proven far left guy, persecuting a far right guy for political reasons and hatred.
They only need to give 1 person reasonable doubt, not even have that person be a Trump, far right person.
I think that Trump will get off.
However, his campaign has received a massive shot in the arm and I still suspect thats really what the Ds want. Resurrect Trump so he can wreck the R party more(damaged his own party several times worse than anybody in history) at a time when Biden is REALLY wrecking the D party and America at the same time.
The only person that can't beat Biden is Trump. The only person that Biden can beat IS Trump.
DeSantis will be the next president and its the only hope our country has, hopefully not too late!
It is another indication that the former president may be widening his lead over the Florida governor.
https://www.politico.com/news/2023/03/29/fox-poll-trump-desantis-00089593
+++++++++++++++++
There is a 100% chance that they knew this would happen. Very few Rs are realizing this to be an intentional D tactic. To use their very predictable reaction against them.......elevating the dying power that irrefutably wrecked the R party more than any other in history back to a position to wreck it more.
There were a number of public surveys conducted in the lead up to the indictment. And they all showed a similar story.
https://www.politico.com/news/2023/03/31/donald-trump-indictment-00090001
A year ago, the investigation into the former president appeared from the outside to be over. But a series of crucial turning points led to this week’s indictment.
https://www.nytimes.com/2023/03/31/nyregion/alvin-bragg-trump-investigation.html
"Mr. Trump is widely loathed in Manhattan"
+++++++++++++
There's no way the NYT doesn't know that their article is describing the quintessential politically motivated investigation and attack by prosecutors against Trump. They seem to be very much enjoying it too.
They describe thousands of hours over years with dozens of people who had singled Trump out for investigations into everything and anything they thought they could charge and convict him of. They weren't sure which one it would be but they would keep investigating everything until they found it.
I have no doubt that they DO have the compelling evidence or this indictment would have never been filed but look what they did to get it.
What other person would have resulted in millions in tax payer money to investigate him for years?
The time and money, probably equates to many thousands of times what they typically spend on individual repeat criminals that need to be taken off the streets but get set free because of Bragg's new ideology as chief prosecutor.
This is almost 100% the opposite of where I was a few days ago BEFORE I gathered the objective facts.
I did not get any of it from listening to sources, especially not far right sources that I consider not credible.
I digested massive authentic facts and applied critical thinking and objective discernment. The open mindedness allowed me to see what I was completely missing.
Especially with regards to Soros. Holy Cow, I never looked into this guy before but he appears to be exactly what the far right claims him to be.
No, I don't hate Jews. I love and respect them.
No, I don't hate blacks. I love and respect them.
The Ds need to deposit that crap in the toilet not in conversations like this one.
No, I definately don't support the psycopath Trump. He does belong in prison for what he did abusing his presidential power as a traitor to his vows to uphold the Constitution and represent Americans. Trying to overturn the proven results of an election, entirely cause the Insurrection and poison the minds of tens of millions of Rs on elections and other topics for at least the next decade.
Did he break lots of other laws?
No doubt.
But going after him for these crimes that didn't really have victims?
When his other crimes mentioned had tens of millions of victims.........in fact, the entire country has suffered
This is so retarded and only makes any sense if they want to resurrect him, as he was dying in the minds of Rs.
And its working exactly as planned while the Rs, think that Trump rising up again is teaching the Ds a lesson. How ironic. Trump is KILLING your party. Biden is killing the country and this is also taking the heat off of him, probably part of the plan.
None of that matters when you are in a cult with 25,000,000 people and have dishonest, unethical politicians that only say things that will get them part of it and act as the high priests of the cult/religion.
It appears that I was wrong in assuming they had some serious felonies on Trump.
Even the guest on far left NPR this afternoon stated that this is mainly just book keeping misdemeanors.
Why in tarnation would they use a dozen people over the course of years at cost that must be over a million $ to tax payers searching for and gathering evidence and come to court with what amounts to book keeping misdemeanors creatively spun/twisted to be felonies used to charge a previous president?
Only 1 answer to that.
We here this is unprecedented. True on it being a previous president. Not true on an extremely similar case:
https://www.politico.com/story/2012/06/justice-dept-wont-retry-john-edwards-077398
By Josh Gerstein
The Justice Department has dropped its prosecution of former Sen. John Edwards over nearly $1 million in payments his backers made to support his pregnant mistress during the 2008 presidential campaign
The formal dismissal of charges was filed in federal court in Greensboro, N.C., on Wednesday. The decision came less than two weeks after Edwards’s trial on the campaign finance-related charges ended when a jury deadlocked on five felony counts and voted to acquit him on one charge.
The one-page filing concluded a prosecution that sparked significant criticism of the Justice Department by campaign finance lawyers who deemed the case legally flawed and by Democratic activists who considered it a form of political payback from a Republican prosecutor in North Carolina.
++++++++++
I know that in Trump's case they will have 10 times more documents to support Trump doing the exact same thing, to hide affairs from the public before the 2016 election.
In his case, however he then committed crimes trying to cover it up with his business records because he didn't want anybody to discover the hush money payments.. Those are the crimes. That's it.
Get this. Trump didn't pay Cohen with just 1 lump sum because it would stick out/be obvious, so he broke that total amount down into numerous payments and Bragg, absurdly counted each payment as a separate crime.
Using this justification/application of the law, when Governor of Arkansas, Bill Clinton took the $100,000 bribe from Tyson Foods thru a Refco commodities account opened by Hillary in 1978 with $1,000 (and got off completely by testifying behind closed doors against the broker and Refco) the Clintons actually committed 100 crimes. 1 for each trade that added up to the $100,000 bribe that the Clinton's got to keep.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/politics/special/whitewater/stories/wwtr940527.htm
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hillary_Clinton_cattle_futures_controversy
One analysis performed by Auburn University and published in the Journal of Economics and Finance claimed to find that the odds of a return as large as Clinton obtained during the period in question were about one in 31 trillion.
As it happened, during the period of Clinton's trading, Refco was under investigation by the Mercantile Exchange for systematic violations of its margin trading rules and reporting requirements regarding cattle trading.[3][8] In December 1979, the exchange issued a three-year suspension to Bone and a $250,000 fine of Refco (at the time, the largest such penalty imposed by the exchange)
There never was any official governmental investigation into,[4] or findings about, or charges brought regarding Hillary Rodham's cattle futures trading.[7]
++++++++++++++++++++++++
That $100,000 bribe to Governor Bill Clinton was a very clever covering up of a LEGIT, serious felony that was never even investigated that every non political trader alive knows was a bribe.
It has nothing to do with this really but is fun to show the bias of our legal system. In this case, in trumping up the charges for 1 crime to make them a dozen crimes because of installment payments for the crime.
We don't know everything yet but enough is known to cause me to believe even more that they did this to resurrect Trump that was on the verge of being forgotten, so they can have him be the guy running in 2024.
Democrats want Trump so badly and know that he's the only guy that they can beat as Biden and the Ds have mostly massive failures to run on.
Funny thing is Bragg spinning one of Trump's biggest crimes as doing this to try to influence the 2016 election.
Is this guy for real?
Charging the top guy running from the other party with insanely trumped up crimes before the upcoming election is not trying to influence the 2024 election???
That fact, by itself is plenty enough to get Trump off.
Just convince 1 juror that the DA is doing this to affect the election or persecuting him for political agenda. I hate to say it but if I was an honest, objective juror, I would be strongly inclined to find him not guilty based on that fact and I extremely dislike Trump.
Alan Dershowitz, who is always a favorite for his clear discernment with profound reasoning, just said:
"I challenge Alvin Bragg to show me 1 person in the history of the world that paid hush money who disclosed it at the time"
The entire point of hush money is to hide something or keep somebody quiet so that people don't find out about it.
In this case, what he was trying to hide was NOT a crime. Having an affair is not a crime.
Committing a murder or robbery is a crime. Paying hush money to cover up a crime like that is different than paying hush money for having an affair.
++++++++++++
https://www.upcounsel.com/legally-binding-non-disclosure-agreement
A legally binding non disclosure agreement (NDA) obliges a party to keep certain information confidential or face legal consequences. Protected information in an NDA can range from company practices and intellectual property to information that could negatively affect an individual's reputation like an extramarital affair.
NDAs are common in the business world. Employees and business partners are often required to sign an NDA to protect company trade secrets and intellectual property. NDAs can be used in a variety of cases where the receiving party's silence is wanted so long as the subject isn't being asked to remain silent about illegal activities.
++++++++++++++
What Trump had with these women was legally binding non disclosure agreements. He obviously falsified records to cover up his non disclosure agreements, which is part of the crime but the original action was not a crime.
What a joke with charging him with defrauding voters to influence an election by hiding this information.
This is so retarded, except for the only motive that seems obvious. Outrage Rs who will nominate Trump on the R ticket, so whoever the Ds run will turn into NOT Donald Trump which has been the biggest winner in the last 2 elections.
Resurrect the guy so he will wreck his party even more. It's spelled out clearly here:
https://www.marketforum.com/forum/topic/91572/
https://www.marketforum.com/forum/topic/88976/
Democrats spent nearly $53 million in nine states through September in an effort to boost far-right candidates to victory, according to a Washington Post analysis last week. Entering the fall, Democrats' risky strategy could very well pay off, particularly in one race many observers see as critical to the party maintaining its slim Senate majority next Congress.
https://www.marketforum.com/forum/topic/88528/#88736
List of links that show how tens of millions of Rs are part of a cult that can't think clearly or critically when it comes to issues involving Trump.
https://www.marketforum.com/forum/topic/88118/#88121
I greatly despise Trump and see him for who he is and believe that if there were true justice for his REAL crimes since losing the election, he would be in prison with a life sentence.
However, what Bragg is doing actually ticks me off and causes me to be compelled to defend Trump based on facts.
Imagine the mind of actual republicans right now.
Actually, no need to imagine. Just observe in real time! Taking the bait, hook, line and sinker. It will make the upcoming race an amazing spectacle.
I still think that DeSantis will destroy him in debates and on accomplishments. Florida is doing extremely well and he has impeccable ethics. Playing the victim can only take Trump so far.
Will his campaign slogan be "Vote for Donald Trump because the Ds hate me!"
Works well on April 4, 2023 and he would win the R ticket by a landslide if the voting was today but he has gradually become more delusional and extreme with his lunatic, narcissistic rants that brag about accomplishments that never happened..
In a debate, anybody with a few objective brains cells should be able to see a monumental difference.............that means NON far right Rs and Independents.
Since the Ds are afflicted with half a dozen self inflicted disasters right now, domestic and foreign policies both, they can only win in 2024 if Trump runs.
That's what this indictment is all about.
One of the saddest elements to this is the cost to NY taxpayers to do this.
Surely the attorney's/detectives cost so far for the investigation is into the single digit millions. However, the massive security required recently/today, along with the numerous other court appearances is likely going to cost the NYPD and tax payers over 100 million EXTRA in spending, on top of their already over spending.
The New York City Police Department’s budget overage defies a pledge by Mayor Eric Adams to cut overtime spending by half in his first year in office.
Before taking office, Mayor Eric Adams pledged to reduce the NYPD’s overtime spending by half in his first year by deploying officers more efficiently and reducing the number on duty at parades and other events.
Yet, the NYPD has spent $472 million on officer overtime through February, exceeding its budget by $98 million, according to a report from New York City Comptroller Brad Lander. The final tally will be much higher because the fiscal year ends June 30. Lander’s office said the department is on pace to spend $740 million, which would be the most in a decade.
The New York Police Department (NYPD) has ordered every member of the force to report in full uniform on Friday as a “precautionary measure,” following former President Trump’sindictment.
“All uniformed members of the New York City Police Department are to show up in uniform as of 0700 hours on 03-31-2023 as a precautionary measure,” a spokesperson said on Thursday night.
++++++++++++
All this to get 1 person for falsifying records, trying to keep people from knowing about some legally binding non disclosure agreements?
No, it's not worth it for that reason.
However, it's worth 1,000 times that if it causes him to be the R on the ticket in 2024.
Hey.........wait a second, that would be a federal crime committing election interference.
However ironic. The prosecutor is actually committing the crime that they are accusing Trump of.
The Manhattan prosecutors office in cahoots with other D strategists knew dang well that this would catapult Donald Trump to a huge lead for the R presidential ticket.
They are the ones using this to commit election interference.
Here's another blatant example, this time helping Joe Biden:
https://www.grassley.senate.gov/news/remarks/twitter-and-2020-election-interference
Trump charged with hush-money scheme to boost 2016 election chances
Prosecutor Chris Conroy said: "The defendant Donald J. Trump falsified New York business records in order to conceal an illegal conspiracy to undermine the integrity of the 2016 presidential election and other violations of election laws."
While falsifying business records in New York on its own is a misdemeanor punishable by no more than one year in prison, it is elevated to a felony punishable by up to four years when done to advance or conceal another crime, such as election law violations.
The two women in the case are adult film actress Stormy Daniels and former Playboy model Karen McDougal.
+++++++++++++++
I couldn't resist posting this article.........there are many dozens like it.
1. How ironic and hypocritical that these extreme, trumped up charges are filed by a far left prosecutor against a far right guy running for president and the bogus felony part, actually defines exactly what THEY ARE DOING TO TRUMP! They are accusing him of what they are quite obviously doing.
2. This happened many years ago. They had this information well before Trump announced he was running in 2024. The legit time to file charges was BEFORE he was running.
3. Trump was trying to protect his own reputation. I think most reasonable people will connect to this. He may have broken some laws by falsifying records but most reasonable people will get his justification to protect himself from the negativity of .......NOT A CRIME but a couple of affairs.
4. The prosecutor, on the other hand is out for blood using politics against another person. This isn't self presservation, like Trump can justify but instead, singling out Trump and targeting him, not just for politics but as the front runner of the opposing party. Using a dozen people and million bucks of tax payers money to go after a guy for trying to cover up his hush money payments.
5. If I lived in NY and didn't hate Trump, I would be ticked off that they used all this time and resources in the midst of increasing crime in NYC and a policy of this guy to not prosecute many crimes.
6. I guess they were too busy investigating crimes from somebody that lied about hush money. Who is the victim(s) in these crimes? The American people? I'm guessing they might be adding the election part because people connect Trump and election fraud, so gullible folks, might actually believe this is just another incident of election fraud by Trump???
Maybe they will insert a Russian angle in there (-: Maybe they consulted with Mueller on the best strategy to maximize and draw out a fraudulent investigation/prosecution to maximize the damage to a political opponent.
Just so we're clear on the Mueller joke. This was no joke:
Mueller's bs
https://www.marketforum.com/forum/topic/87230/#87231
Regardless of the analysis above, it seems clear that the dems must know this. Trump indicates that he too wants to draw this thing out.
so the dems and trump want the same impact….for trump to get the R nomination. So they can run NOT Donald Trump, the person winning the most elections, staring in 2020.
we are living in unprecedented times, folks. This big circus and the Dynamics defining it are making our country look pretty bad. Even worse is that the United Stayes has created several enemies …Russia, China, Middle East and a few others that align with them. NATO on the other hand, absolutely loves us Because we protect and fund them and line up with their fake climate crisis agenda. Our new global enemies are all FOR fossil fuels.
Guess which side has the energy policy that will continue to help their economy and which side has the energy,policy hurting their economy?
in the last year, natural gas supplies have surged to a record,…..but what you might have missed, is that the fake green energy crowd decided to redefine natural gas as green energy instead of a fossil fuel to eliminate….so they can continue with the agenda……which has nothing to do with climate.
I mention this (again) as an example, just like the trump indictment is. examples of what define our gatekeepers in todays world. Entities that manufacture realities and use convincing, often fraudulent marketing schemes to manipulate people for their self serving agenda!
This is the real reason:
Donald Trump is banking on Republicans agreeing with him that the system is out to get him—and to smash the movement he started.
++++++++++++++++
Why is every entity acting like Joe Biden will be the D candidate.
1. Too old and often confused
2. Too unpopular
3. Track record of massive failures across the board as president.
4. History of corruption and lies
Usually, just 1 of the top 3 will prevent a person from running. #4 seems to be what gets presidents elected in today's age )-:
+++++++++++++
https://www.npr.org/2023/04/04/1167708172/trump-charges-hush-money-new-york-indictment
https://www.marketforum.com/forum/topic/77019/#94077
https://www.marketforum.com/forum/topic/77019/#94360
By metmike - March 25, 2023, 5:46 a.m.
i couldn’t be more certain about this.
Donald Trump’s influence on the world is almost 100% damaging today with no redeeming features Left to salvage because his rapidly advancing, clinically significant mental illness has deteriorated his psyche into being unfit to lead any entity
extremely harmful to society, wherever he attempts to impose His degrading influence.
Supporting him in any way, shape or any form of enabling, elevating his importance is very destructive to the individuals doing it as well as to the country of the United States.
sympathizing with or defending his off the charts bad behavior makes you his victim and makes the world a worse place.
pooping on both those that he hates and even more, pooping into the minds of those that he uses for self serving objectives By stealing their intelligence, integrity and critical thinking.
If you're one of the tens of millions in his cult and are reading this..........it might as well be in a foreign language!
++++++++++++++++++
By metmike - April 5, 2023, 10:45 a.m.
And the Ds are exploiting this trait of Donald Trump to strengthen him intentionally, using the Rs against themselves.
Let's just hope that this enormous negative impact and their diabolical trick wears off before the election and somebody like Ron DeSantis with more positive messages will be nominated.
However, even DeSantis will need to appeal to the extreme elements in his party that he himself displays with his personal belief system.
So there isn't a person capable of reversing the off the charts divisiveness in our country by appealing to the commonality related to our humanity that we all share.
It's impossible to imagine somebody like that in this age........but we should pray for it!
We need a person like this to lead us out of darkness.
Greatest FORMER President in history/J. Carter
https://www.marketforum.com/forum/topic/93232/
MLK
https://www.marketforum.com/forum/topic/92441/#92519
https://www.marketforum.com/forum/topic/92242/
In my book, Bill Barr has a tremendous amount of objectivity and credibility!
D's write him off just because they assume that he's a Trump guy but he's proven to be a strait shooter based on numerous comments against Trump.
The former president is also facing several other investigations, including the events related to the Capitol riot on January 6, 2021, and his alleged involvement in trying to overturn the 2020 presidential election results in Georgia.
"The president, unfortunately, has a penchant for engaging in reckless and self-destructive behavior that brings these kinds of things on him," Barr said Sunday, adding that it "doesn't surprise" him that the former president is facing several legal woes.
++++++++++++++++++++++++
The evidence against Trump with regards to the Capital riot on January 6th is authentic and very compelling. It's several times what is needed to convict most people to time in prison.
Let's think about this in a rational way. Which one of these things are worse, #1 or #2?
1. Betraying our country and Constitution.
Blatantly Abusing his presidential power for 2 months (with documented incidents and testimony) trying to overturn the most secure, tested and proven presidential election in history.
inspired his supporters to violently riot, breaking into the capital building in order to stop the newly elected president from being sworn into office.(don’t believe the nonsense from Tucker that they were peaceful because mcCarthy geve him access to 40,000 hours of videos so he could pluck out some peaceful moments and use those to blatantly MISrepresent the entire event).
Permanently poisoned the brains of tens of millions of republicans with regards to the most sacred feature defining our democracy…….free and fair and trusted elections.
all because he lost fair and square in 2020, refuses to acknowledge it and in the most diabolical act for any politician in history has turned most of his party against what we stand for as Americans…..honest elections and accepting results.
his supporters are forever convinced that elections which republicans lose are rigged…including those in power
OR is this worse:
2. Paying money to 2 woman that he had an affair with in a very legal nondisclosure agreement(hush money) THEN breaking the misdeamer laws by trying to cover it up by falsifying documents.
#1 hurt every American and this country and continues to destroy his own, R party, the longer his cult leader status is supported.
#2 made Stormy Daniels a rich and famous celebrity and she's loving almost all of it. Where are the other victims?
So why in the world would a D party prosecutor bring charges against him for #1 when it's such nonsense?
Answer: "continues to destroy his own R party"
https://www.alternet.org/cnn-burnt-to-a-crisp/
Listening to Trump last night on Tucker was very enlightening/reinforcing.
He has the ability to make brilliant, authentic deductions in some realms but its gets completely drown out by his delusional rants which massively exaggerate some things and completely manufacture others.
His main objective was clearly to convince listeners how great he is.
I've dabbled a bit in human psychiatric disorders and can tell you with absolute confidence that this man is the quintessential example of:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grandiosity
In psychology, grandiosity is a nonnormative sense of superiority, uniqueness, or invulnerability. It may be expressed by exaggerated beliefs regarding one's abilities, the belief that few other people have anything in common with oneself, and that one can only be understood by a few, very special people.[1] The personality trait of grandiosity is principally associated with narcissistic personality disorder (NPD), but also is a feature in the occurrence and expression of antisocial personality disorder, and the manic and hypomanic episodes of bipolar disorder
++++++++++++
In most realms, his friends and family would seek psychiatric treatment to help him with this serious disorder.
In the current environment, because of his charisma and power, his disorder has elevated him to a cult leader with 10's of millions of brain captured republicans wanting him to be president...........instead of wanting him to get mental health treatment.
+++++++++++
Tucker on the other hand is king of the media charlatans. He's used a gifted ability to creatively manufacture fake realities that the far right wants to hear into being #1 in the ratings. That's why he had Trump on last night.........ratings for his show. That's why Trump came on last night...........Tucker needs Trump for ratings, Trump needs Tucker to to brainwash his supporters.
The bottom line is that Fox/Tucker benefit and Trump benefits at the expense of their believing victims/viewers watching and R party.
And the Ds benefit too. The longer they can trick Rs into worshiping Trump, the more damage he can do to the R party and the more wins the NOT Donald Trump candidates can rack up.
Trump's campaign sent out multiple fundraising asks following the news of his indictment.
https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/donald-trump/trump-raised-4-million-day-indictment-rcna77699
+++++++++++++++++
What's ironic is that Trump is using part of that money to run an anti DeSantis smearing campaign on Fox news.
So the Ds indicting Trump, has not only revived him but its resulted in more money going towards targeting/taking down the candidate that could win in 2024. Not D money to do it but amazingly, R money to destroy their own guy.
The group has reserved at least $1.3 million in airtime so far, per AdImpact
“The more you learn about DeSantis the more you learn he doesn’t share our values. He’s just not ready to be president,” a narrator says in the ad from MAGA, Inc.
+++++++++
As of today, that ad continues, at least at Fox at a cost of over 2 million since it started less than 2 weeks ago.
Here's the indisputable evidence that Trump CAN'T win the general election against Biden. He would likely do worse against anybody else (except, maybe Harris) because Biden is so weak.
April 12, 2023
A Reuters/Ipsos poll conducted after the indictment found Trump leading DeSantis by 58% to 21% among Republican voters, a gain of 10 percentage points from a week earlier.
A Yahoo News/YouGov surveytaken March 30-31 found that Trump held a 57% to 31% advantage over DeSantis among Republican voters, building on an eight-point lead just two weeks before.
An ABC News/Ipsos poll,in the field April 6 and 7, showed that Trump’s unfavorable rating climbed to 61% from 55% a week prior. The former president’s favorability rating sank to 25% from 29% in that period.
In the same poll, 80-year-old Biden’s unfavorable rating fell slightly from 49% to 48% and his favorability rating rose to 34% from 32%.
An Economist/YouGov surveythat polled Americans April 1-4 found that Trump had a 51% to 44% unfavorable to favorable rating, while Biden’s spread was 49% unfavorable and 45% favorable.
According to the RealClearPolitics average of polls in the field between March 12 and April 11, Trump’s favorability was at 38.4%, trailing Biden’s 42.1% favorability. The average unfavorable rating told a similar story, with Biden at 52.4% and Trump on 55.8%.
I looked back and the last election was almost this bad but Trump is now slightly worse with less favorable and Biden modestly worse in both categories:
https://news.gallup.com/poll/320411/trump-biden-favorable-ratings-below.aspx
| Favorable | Unfavorable | No opinion | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| % | % | % | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Donald Trump | 41 | 57 | 2 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Joe Biden | 46 | 50 | 4 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Mike Pence | 41 | 50 | 9 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Kamala Harris | 42 | 43 | 15 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Gallup, Aug. 31-Sep. 13, 2020 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
The same thing defined the 2016 election too. Both candidates had higher UNfavorable ratings compared to favorable.
Before 2016, this was completely unheard of! (other than Barr Goldwater in 1964).
Look at the graph below. In the past, it was the total opposite. The bottom half of the candidates below had at least double the favorable vs unfavorable rating.
The bottom 8 had around a 4 times more favorable vs unfavorable opinion. The bottom 3 were around 6 times more favorable vs unfavorable.
This is absolute proof of a monumental problem for US politics in this age!!!
Candidates since 2016 are literally winning presidential elections by NOT being the other person.
https://news.gallup.com/poll/197231/trump-clinton-finish-historically-poor-images.aspx
| Nominee | Total favorable | Total unfavorable | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| % (+1 to +5) | % (-1 to -5) | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 2016 Nov 2-5 | D. Trump | 36 | 61 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 2016 Nov 2-5 | H. Clinton | 47 | 52 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 1964 Oct 8-13 | B. Goldwater | 43 | 47 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 2012 Oct 27-28 | M. Romney | 55 | 43 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 1972 Oct 13-16 | G. McGovern | 55 | 41 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 2004 Oct 22-24 | J. Kerry | 57 | 40 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 1992 Oct 23-25 | G.H.W. Bush | 59 | 40 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 2004 Oct 22-24 | G.W. Bush | 61 | 39 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 2012 Oct 27-28 | B. Obama | 62 | 37 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 1980 Oct 10-13 | R. Reagan | 64 | 37 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 2008 Oct 23-26 | B. Obama | 62 | 35 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 2008 Oct 23-26 | J. McCain | 63 | 35 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 1984 Sep 21-24 | W. Mondale | 66 | 34 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 1992 Oct 23-25 | B. Clinton | 64 | 33 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 1980 Oct 10-13 | J. Carter | 68 | 32 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 1956 Oct 18-23 | A. Stevenson | 61 | 31 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 1984 Sep 21-24 | R. Reagan | 71 | 30 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 1968 Oct 17-22 | H. Humphrey | 72 | 28 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 1968 Oct 17-22 | R. Nixon | 79 | 22 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 1972 Oct 13-16 | R. Nixon | 76 | 21 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 1976 Sep 24-27 | G. Ford | 78 | 20 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 1960 Oct 18-23 | R. Nixon | 79 | 16 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 1976 Sep 24-27 | J. Carter | 81 | 16 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 1960 Oct 18-23 | J. Kennedy | 80 | 14 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 1964 Oct 8-13 | L. Johnson | 81 | 13 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| 1956 Oct 18-23 | D. Eisenhower | 84 | 12 | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| No data for 1988, 1996 and 2000 | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Gallup | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
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So the obvious effective strategy much of the time in recent years is to run negative ads to try to get you to hate the other person and NOT vote for them by choosing the candidate who's running against the NOT person!