Every scientist knows that in a science experiment, if you want credible results to prove something is tied to something else, you keep all the variables constant EXCEPT FOR THE ONE that you are trying to show caused the results to change when you changed only that 1 variable.

India vs Israel or India vs the US is the exact way to NOT do a credible science experiment to see how the vaccinated vs unvaccinated compare because of the several significant variables that are different and are affecting the results.

https://www.marketforum.com/forum/topic/75350/#75353

How about the US vaccinated vs the US unvaccinated...............where the only changed variable is vaccination? Why is this not no brainer science???

 By metmike - Sept. 23, 2021, 5:23 a.m.            

https://www.marketforum.com/forum/topic/75252/#75261

Thanks, bear.  I must agree, comparing 2 countries has hidden problems.

You (and metmike) mentioned old age, ivermectin and malaria drugs. The old-age issue I have already debated in the previous thread.   I don’t quite buy that one.

Ivermectin (plus an antibiotic) is indeed mentioned by the government of India,  and malaria meds may also be something to make a difference.. After all, they were a topic of debate in the US when the Covid first appeared, and any mention of them was quickly removed from our media.

I am not sure whether the Ivermectin treatment is the cause of them doing well, or whether it is coincidental.

Either way…. I don’t have answers for all this… I only have questions.

One side tells us we need to be vaxxed, or we will die, and they show us spectacular graphs of the Unvaccinated winding up in the hospital….and on the other side, in India, they have almost beat the virus without vaccination.

Something does not compute here!!!!

And then you have Israel… a key country in the fight against the Delta,  and  they are being hit very hard, in spite of being heavily vaccinated.

Is it any wonder that some people ask, why bother with a vaccine?  ( and we are not even addressing the issue of vaxx-related problems and deaths)

There are some 120 mill people in the US who are not vaccinated… and they have been unvaccinated since the virus arrived 19 months ago… and they are still walking around.

They have to put all the info into perspective and make their own decision.

Gunter,

Ivermectin is also a huge variable that could be responsible for the better outcomes in India. As mentioned many times, I believe ivermectin helps.

But it’s absolutely NOT a replacement for what we know helps the most.....getting vaccinated.

Using the number of people that did not get vaccinated in the US that lived as evidence that people should not get vaccinated is  another case of your own examples/evidence are sometimes the strongest proof of how wrong that you are Gunter. 

If you just compare your stat with people that survived who DID get vaccinated it pretty compelling in favor of the benefits of vaccination.

The hospitals and morgues filling up with mostly unvaccinated people ......and your case is like.........just look at the unoccupied beds left in many hospitals and just look at the unsold caskets!!

It’s called cherry picking your data and distorting the perspective.

Getting vaccinated compared to not getting vaccinated increases your chances of surviving COVID by around 10 times.

That’s what matters!

All this other smoke and mirrors, junk science DISinformation is just a friggin sideshow trying to confuse and mislead people into thinking it’s an issue of personal freedoms or government over reach.

The only over reach going on here is  by one side violating science and truth and ethical standards for their 100% political agenda.

I’m fighting that sides nefarious, dangerous, divisive and diaboligical objectives.

I hope that you will join me and not oppose me.....but you still have a right to have an opinio.

Just know that it will continue to be held to basic scientific and factual standards.

Wouldn’t it be much easier to use authentic science and facts then to constantly be shown as violating them?

The main subject of the original post was the issue of India being covid-free and unvaxxed, while highly vaxxed Israel is being hit hard.

You focused on a side comment I made at the end of my last post, when I wrote “there are some 120 mill people in the US who are not vaccinated… and they have been unvaccinated since the virus arrived 19 months ago… and they are still walking around.”

You took offense by this comment (comparing it with empty caskets, etc), and countered with a quite similar thought….”If you just compare your stat with people that survived who DID get vaccinated it pretty compelling in favor of the benefits of vaccination.”

Yes, as of today, some 183 mill people are fully vaccinated in the USA.  Are you insinuating that these people would be dead, had they not been vaccinated?  How would you get that idea??? It is quite possible that they all would still be alive today without vaccination…. just like the unvaxxed ones.

In the end, the unvaxxed people have to choose what to do.  

The Covid survival rate in the USA is 99.8%

Repeating the same things won't make it science.

My points have been crystal clear. 

Data is science.

Using the same country and changing just 1 variable(vaccinations) is good apples to apples science.(changing numerous variables and using that as evidence that 1 of the variables is responsible for all the results is bad science)

Comparisons with SIMILAR countries that have the least amount of  different variables is good apples to apples science.

These are examples of solid objective science.

By metmike - Sept. 23, 2021, 5:23 a.m.            

https://www.marketforum.com/forum/topic/75252/#75261

Why fight this science Gunter? It's futile when conversing with an objective scientist. Are you just making a play to the anti COVID vaccine crowd here that will buy your anti COVID vaccine stuff or is your comprehension of this compromised for some reason?

If that's not it, then why keep rejecting the science?

With no other reasonable explanation, it leads me to speculate on  why you an tens of millions of others are rejecting the data and authentic science.

And just like the apples to apples science mentioned about,  if we keep most of the other variables constant and throw in far right anti COVID vaccinations sources compared to no far right COVID vaccinations sources...........it 100% explains the anti COVID vaccination belief system that is causing the people that go to those sources to vehementally rejected the COVID vaccine.

Those that are the most educated about COVID, medical doctors and scientists have a much higher rate of believing in the vaccination, so there is an INVERSE relationship with using the most credible sources.

Yeah, I know that you guys would prefer to believe the sources that contradict most of the experts.......outliers. 

I did objectively look at those outliers too based on dozens of hours of research. 

They are right about Ivermectin based on the OBJECTIVE science.

They are dead wrong about the COVID vaccinations based on the OBJECTIVE science.

So sad that nobody is for vaccinations AND for Ivermectin.

Know why?

Because one political side says you must get vaccinated and Ivermectin is bad.

The other political side says Ivermectin is really good and vaccinations are bad.

And for many, including you, this is almost entirely about politics........and not science as I've show conclusively with your posts.

If that wasn't true, you would be embracing, not rejecting this:

https://www.marketforum.com/forum/topic/75252/#75261

But that's your problem. My problem is to make sure this site represents authentic science and does what it can to SAVE lives not propagandize minds.