trying to understand "law and order"
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Started by GunterK - June 16, 2021, 2:27 p.m.

I am trying to understand the concept of law and order in the US….

For more than a year, we have seen never-ending insurrection in our cities. Stores were looted and burned down, the police was attacked, there was more than 2 bill in damage, etc etc.

Very few of these people have been arrested. And the ones who did get arrested, were quickly released through the efforts of VP Harris.

What is the message here?

Let’s assume there is a guy who wants a nice new TV. All he has to do, get into his pickup truck, and run it through the window display of a computer store, load the TV into his truck, on the way out maybe grab a few iPhones, and throw a Molotov cocktail into the store and burn it down, before leaving.

All that is required from him is to carry a picture of George Floyd, or wear a t-shirt with the slogan “I can’t breathe”, and he is considered a “warrior of social justice”

I don’t get it.

Now, on Jan 6, there was another ‘insurrection”. A large number of people were upset about alleged election fraud..

Of course, the Capitol building has a different meaning than a computer store. It’s the seat of government!!!

Many of them were filmed breaking through glass windows, and “breaking in” is definitely is a crime. But other films showed how the police opened the door for the protesters, let them in and even guided them. Those guys cannot even be charged with “trespassing”, since they were invited to enter, IMHO.

Yet, all of those who entered the building (and maybe some who stayed outside) have now been held in jail, the ones who did damage, as well as the ones who were invited to enter.

And on some sites it is suggested that they are being tortured. (can’t verify this). 

But we know for sure, their lives are now ruined, there business shuttered, their jobs lost.

And they are being charged as “terrorists”… they are on the same level as Atta (the alQaeda agent who flew an airliner into the WTC on 9/11)

I don’t get it

The records show that 5 people died during this Jan 6 insurrection, apparently 4 of them of unrelated medical issues, but one person was shot dead.

Her name was Ashly Babbit. Like many others, she had traveled to Washington to protest the election. She was unarmed, but she was shot while climbing through an already broken window.

Since she was clearly inside the building while being shot, this identifies her as a “terrorist”, of the same league as alQaeda terrorists of 9/11. This should make the police officer who shot her a national hero… after all, he killed a terrorist "in the act" and saved countless lives. Will they make a movie about this hero? Well, no… they haven’t even released the name of this hero.

I don’t get it!

Maybe, in the future, it will all become clearer.

By mcfarm - June 16, 2021, 2:35 p.m.
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Oh you understand this new system of law and order perfectly. You bring race and sexual orientation and various other things into the discussion and add that final crooked straw of which side of the political aisle you come from and suddenly you are living in a different country. Hillary and the Biden crime family are the 2 shinning stars at the moment, then add the twist of the FBI as an arm of the DNC and its complete. Old Chris Wray was before a congressional hearing just yesterday and if lying were a death sentence he would of been struck by lightning several times. By the way lying where he was yesterday is a felony. We were taught justice is blind when we grew up, suddenly the entire system is blind.

By metmike - June 16, 2021, 3:30 p.m.
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They are amplifying the actual physical events on Jan. 6th to what seems, at least 10 times worse than the actual amount of physical damage and actual objectives of those involved.

They are clearly doing this for entirely political objectives.

This is resulting in the other side as downplaying it as being a bunch of routy tourists that temporarily lost their way, which just makes the first side above, feel they have to make it even worse because, it's just another one of those political battles, where both sides manufacture extreme narratives and subjective facts  to make the other side look bad and their side look good. This is no longer about facts, truth and justice.

Any person that participated personally in that riot that day that did anything at any time related to breaking the law on that day has been identified like no other investigation and is being prosecuted to the full extent of the law. 

That's real justice. Maybe even overkill because of some of the extreme bail requirements and manner that is not going to cut them any slack and assumes them guilty until proven innocent.

But that should be the end of it. 

However, I am way, way more concerned about the toxic mindset that led to this riot because it seems to be getting worse by the day. 

Well over half of  republicans have completely lost touch with the real world. They are totally delusional about the most secure election in decades and are convinced that Biden stole it based on.............not a dang thing other than that's what they are being told, with dozens of false allegations proving that the fraud is ALL coming from the side claiming there was widespread fraud.

This is scary as hell.

This caused the riot on Jan. 6 but the riot was over and done in a matter of hours.

The mindset that caused it was just getting started. Now, that side is twisting the meaning of everything. Believing only their far right sources and not allowing anybody to even question those sources with legit facts. Getting paranoid and irrational. This is the recipe for unstable types to do some great harm to those that they now hate, thanks in great part to the brainwashing they get on the internet.

This has turned into a cult/religion in every sense of the word.   Yeah, saying I'm concerned would be a vast understatement because its getting worse every time that I look. 

By GunterK - June 16, 2021, 4:50 p.m.
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Metmike, your comment is a fair assessment of this situation. Thank you.

No doubt, the nation is becoming more and more divided. The “stolen election” mantra will not go away.

Neither will the mantra of “the most secure election in history”…. and that’s the only objection I have to your post.

Yes, no proof has been brought up in court to shows that there was election fraud… and “recounts” were done numerous times, showing no change.

However, there definitely were numerous “irregularities” that made this election anything but the “most secure’.

I am not saying that Trump was the real winner… I am only saying there are numerous questions that linger.

In my own limited understanding of all this, I still remember that CNN clip, showing how suddenly a large chunk of votes was subtracted from Trump and added to Biden.

In Michigan, they called a similar event a “computer glitch”. The one I saw, I believe, was from Pennsylvania. I don’t care how many recounts they made. I want to see an explanation of how such a “computer glitch” is possible. I want to see the software code that makes something like this possible. As far as I know, Dominion has not allowed any inspection of their code.

I would even accept an explanation that this video clip was “photoshopped”…. but so far, I have seen no explanation.

By metmike - June 16, 2021, 5:11 p.m.
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"In my own limited understanding of all this, I still remember that CNN clip, showing how suddenly a large chunk of votes was subtracted from Trump and added to Biden.

In Michigan, they called a similar event a “computer glitch”. The one I saw, I believe, was from Pennsylvania. I don’t care how many recounts they made. I want to see an explanation of how such a “computer glitch” is possible. I want to see the software code that makes something like this possible. As far as I know, Dominion has not allowed any inspection of their code.

I would even accept an explanation that this video clip was “photoshopped”…. but so far, I have seen no explanation."

Or you just forgot one that I already gave you here , so here it is again Gunter.

Every second of every day from all the major news stations is being taped from their competitors. During the election, every second is being taped from competitors AND people with political interests that are following it closely.

Add by the thousands at least, of viewers that could not watch it live, that recorded it on their equipment at home to play and watch later.

Out of all those recordings, you are trying to tell me that there is not one of them out there today to verify this? And that the Trump team, that threw everything and the kitchen sink(mostly using contents from a used but unflushed toilet)  at trying to create uncertainty with many dozens of allegations of fake fraud...... did not even have one recording of what you claim happened?

That makes no sense Gunter.  I also remember seeing this on the internet shortly after the election and it got passed around to millions......then vanished.

Not because it happened and was censored(because thousands of other people would also have it on their recording) but because it was 100% fake news.

It's now over 7 months later Gunter and I have explained this to you before. Please stop believing in it.

By metmike - June 16, 2021, 5:27 p.m.
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                somebody please "debunk" this.......            

                            13 responses |               

                Started by GunterK - Jan. 5, 2021, 12:05 p.m.     

                By metmike - May 21, 2021, 11:40 p.m.            

                    Just a needed reminder that I have always been about finding legit fraud.

In fact, showing 10 times more legit fraud than everybody else combined here.

By GunterK - June 18, 2021, 11:37 a.m.
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I apologize for diverting the original subject of this thread into another one of those futile election fraud discussions.

However, since you reminded me of the many older forum posts that debated this subject, I feel compelled to respond one more time... 

None of your referenced previous posts about this video give me a satisfactory answer.

I saw what I saw. While the CNN screen showed something else for a few minutes, 19,958 votes were subtracted from Trump, and 19,958 votes were added to Biden. Too bad, I didn’t download it.

There was a similar case in another state, with smaller numbers being switched.

You say it’s fake, because I am the only one talking about it.

Yes, nobody is talking about it anymore… the election is done… it’s over.

However, in November, 100,000s of people saw it also. There was discussion about it on the internet. Maybe that’s one of the reasons why so many Trumpsters still talk about a stolen election.

I am sure, Trump’s legal team also had this video in their arsenal.  If I remember correctly, they claimed to have 20 binders of evidence and affidavits. But somehow, all this never got into any court.

There are only 2 explanations for this video..

  1. the video was faked… photoshopped, or whatever… If somebody could prove this to me, I would be very happy, and I would be done with it.  Saying that the video is ”fake”, simply because nobody talks about it, does not do it for me. As a matter of fact, there was an incident in Michigan, where they admitted that votes were switched, due to a “computer glitch”.  Which takes us to explanation #2

      2) There is an issue with the software.

If there is an issue with the software, there are only 2 possibilities…

  1. sloppy software coding
  2. malicious intent… and I don’t want to accuse the software company of that! Let’s stick with 1)

If there is sloppy coding involved, then the software company better fix it, before the next election takes place.

If I remember correctly, several software specialists demanded to check the software of this voting system (most likely because they saw the same videos)… but the company denied them access.

It seems to me, if I was running this company, I would welcome any outside investigators to go through the software code with a fine tooth comb…. to preserve the reputation of my product and my company.  Avoiding transparency raises questions, IMHO.

Rather than being transparent, they sued their accusers, which looks to me like a legal maneuver to divert scrutiny off their own company.

A study of the software code….that’s what I have been waiting for… I would like for somebody to reveal what makes a computer switch votes from one candidate to another.  Even a “computer glitch” needs some kind of code to make it happen.

Until then…. I saw what I saw.. and what I saw, troubles me.

And again, I never said the ‘election was stolen”, but I simply cannot accept the claim that this was “the most secure election 

By metmike - June 19, 2021, 11:41 a.m.
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I can't tell you much more Gunter.

This is about as no brainer obvious to me as it comes and I've provided  plenty of obvious I guess it will just be another example of cognitive bias.

Once a person thinks that  they know something, it doesn't matter how much evidence you provide for them to see.....their brains only interpret new information based on what they think they know(are convinced that they know), which rejects.......even obvious authentic facts representing truth if it contradicts what they think that they know. 

You guys keep getting offended when I point out blatant, clear examples of cognitive bias with all the objective, one sided authentic facts and instead of learning from these react using the way that deeply entrenched cognitive bias compels you to..........defending the bias even more and being offended because it was accurately identified.

I will repeat this again so you take this the right way. I am your friend and am telling this to you as a friend that agrees with many things that you state. I am not a democrat or the enemy.

I am also here to be a fact checker to try to see that MarketForum messages represent truth. It's perfectly fine to have opinions and make statements that don't represent truth...........again, those are some of my favorites because it provides those that believe in something that is false the opportunity to see the truth based on authentic facts..........learn something that they would not learn from their typical sources that just reinforce their belief systems by telling them the news the way they like to hear/read it.

We will never censor opinions.......instead, we will show authentic facts. Objective facts, not subjective facts or manufactured facts.

I encourage ideas/posts from all positions and my absolute favorites are those that disagree with me. 

I am trying to do this as respectfully as I know how. If I'm failing in that regard, please help me to do better.