The other thread was well beyond needing to be moved to a new thread.
Let's start it off with Gunters post on the new incidents in the next post.
This is the old thread:
https://www.marketforum.com/forum/topic/68659/
Re: Re: Re: Re: Biden/Tim Scott speech-Banning assault weapons used in mass shootings
By GunterK - May 7, 2021, 5:55 p.m.
you guys spoke of society breaking down
Please take a look at these videos from Portland. Society has already broker down. This is worse than the Wild West. This is war.
What would you do???
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Banning assault weapons used in mass shootings
By TimNew - May 7, 2021, 7 p.m.
Ya know.. Every time I hear about the "Wild West" I feel compelled to mention.. it was not that wild.
Everyone was armed. If a bunch of cow pokes showed up shootin up the town, all the businessmen sitting in their offices would put their shotguns and rifles out the window and shut them up right quick. So, the cowpokes didn't do that very often.
Yeah, there were gun fights once in a while and when there were no sherrifs in town, things could get rough. (That's why we need government. Not to raise crops, but to keep the peace) But everyone took confrontations very seriously. They could get you killed, and everyone knew it. The image we have of the "Wild West" is largely a Hollywood creation.
Manners were much better then than they are today. Especially on the internet :-)
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
-Banning assault weapons used in mass shootings
By metmike - May 7, 2021, 8:16 p.m.
"What would you do???"
The 100% opposite of what this nut did. He got out of his car with his gun and was threatening to shoot people with it.....and refusing to leave.
Too funny that info wars has a headline that 100% mischaracterizes what we see on their video.
They state that the protesters beat up this older man and stole his gun.
Let's look at the actual videos to see what really happened. The guy, when there was nothing blocking his path, stopped his vehicle, got well out and confronted everybody, pointing his gun at them.
What were they doing, while he did this? screaming at him to "leave!" "leave!" "leave!" "leave!" but he did the opposite. With no cars blocking his path, he would not leave, putting his car in park in the middle of the street, getting out and confronting them with his gun pointed at them because he was ticked off.
Their attacking him at that point, was actually to "get the gun" "get the gun"in order to disarm him and stop the threat to everyones lives that he was posing. They were very justified in doing this.
Let's look at the other video, where they break out the back window of the car.
That person, actually hits a person that was on the street and knocks them flying off their feet, you can see that happening as they were the ones shooting the video that we initially see. After doing that, they attempted to continue on, when they legally MUST STOP after they caused an accident, especially hitting a person. This is called hit and run.
Whether they hit the person intentionally or not does not matter, they must stop but they refused to stop. Thats when we see the protesters attempting to stop the vehicle and we hear several of them saying to write the license plate number down to report the hit and run.
It was only at that point that this vehicle got attacked as the protesters attempted to get them to stop, as the law requires. You can't just run over people that you don't like and take off because they are blocking your path on the street. It was wrong for them to damage the vehicle after this crime, however.
Though the protesters are causing traffic issues and using fowl, aggressive language, all the video's exonerate them and show the 2 people in the cars committing the crimes and being the ones that triggered the illegal part of the confrontations.
Infowars is so caught up with their hate for these people that they totally missed the fact that they show videos that prove the protesters were the VICTIMS, while Infowars attempts to use verbiage describing the incidents to get people to think that the ones committing the crimes were really the victims.
Things are getting really messed up when we determine crimes and victims based on political affiliations and ignore stone cold facts and evidence that we can see visually, right in front of us but its not connecting to our rational brains.......instead, it's being processed thru a cognitive political filter.
Of course the sources of the news are telling it to us that way....... so all we need to do is believe them.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
By metmike - May 7, 2021, 8:24 p.m.
I reckin we ought to start a new thread on this, since this is obviously one of your favorite topics.
Very entertaining and well done informational/historical video.......enjoy gun lovers!
https://truewestmagazine.com/old-west-guns-22-guns-that-won-the-west/
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
While there were hundreds of different makes and models of firearms used to tame the frontier, let’s take a brief look at a double-deuce—just 22—of the more famous and infamous guns from the Old West, along with some of the good, and the bad, men and women who painted the canvas of America’s Wild West in such bold and vivid colors.
Here's another one with just the guns and year.
https://www.militaryfactory.com/smallarms/wild-west-guns.php
The evolution of firearms is a fascinating story.
Hi metmike, since you moved my brief post from another (very long) thread to here, I would like to respond to your reply to my post.
The subject is the ‘decay of our society”, and a specific link about Antifa. (I posted this link at the end of this post, for those who care to take a look at this video)
I agree, my reference to the Wild West was out of place. Compared to our society (especially since 2020), the Wild West was a peaceful paradise.
You replied to my post, stating that infowars had misrepresented the situation, and you criticized the truck driver in the first video clip, making him the attacker.
The infowars headlines stated:
“Heavily armed Antifa militants block streets, attack drivers while pointing guns at them”
I don’t consider this to be a misleading headline. This is precisely what happened.
During the last year, we have seen plenty of videos of Antifa hitting people with sticks, throwing rocks at the police, etc etc
Now, they have escalated. Now they are threatening civilians with rifles. This is no longer a protest. This is war.
As far as the truck driver in the first video clip is concerned:
The movie starts out, with the camera pointing at the front of the guy’s truck. There is another vehicle that looks like it could be blocking the truck’s path (or maybe not)
Most importantly, in front of the guy’s truck, 2 men seem to be pointing rifles at the guy . The guy seems to have just opened his door and is halfways out. (I don’t see a gun in his hand)
This looks to me like an ambush. He is blocked in, has rifles pointed at him. At this point, his life is in danger. He has no place to go.
At that point the clip is edited. The next scene shows him out of the car. Having being blocked in, he apparently had exited his car to argue with the attackers.
The other car that had blocked him in, is now no longer there.
I agree with your argument… at this point, he should have gotten back into his car and driven off (hopefully without being shot)
But this is not what he did. He ran back to his car and apparently grabbed a gun, came back and pointed the gun at his attackers.
What he did was a dangerous move, it could have easily cost his life.
However, the fact still remains that the Antifa mob first pointed weapons at him. This truck driver is not the “attacker’; if anything, he is defending himself (foolishly, as this may have been done)
It's easy for us to sit at our computers and post about politics and life. How would you feel... how would I feel... if we were driving our cars in our quiet suburban neighborhoods, and suddenly we are ambushed by an AR-15 carrying mob, and have guns pointed at us?.
This is what this breif video is all about... it's our cities, our country. What is happening?????
Unfortunately, few sites nowadays show such events.
https://www.infowars.com/posts/portland-heavily-armed-antifa-militants-block-streets-attack-drivers-while-pointing-guns-at-them/
Hi Gunter,
Thanks for moving the post here. I'm not ignoring you and will comment in a minute!
OK,
Thanks for additional comments. Here are some from me.
1. "However, the fact still remains that the Antifa mob first pointed weapons at him. This truck driver is not the “attacker’; if anything, he is defending himself (foolishly, as this may have been done)"
metmike: The protestors should not have pointed their guns at the guy in the truck, when he was in the short lived traffic jam from the protest on the street. It's likely though with extremely high confidence based entirely on the actions of this screaming nut in the truck, that they responded WRONGLY by pointing their guns at him while he was stuck in traffic. They should never have done that obviously. It just made him more enraged.
2. You claim that he was defending himself. Please note that when his vehicle had already completely passed the protest,and he was not being blocked that he put his truck in park in the middle of the street, and ran back to confront them with a gun pointed at them, while they screamed at him to leave.......leave.....leave. Thats some strange kind of defending.
3. The video that I described earlier that shows this exactly...........HIM being the entire aggressor
4. On the 2nd car, since infowars didn't tell you this. That 2nd car that ran over a protestor was not charged with a crime(though if the protesters had not stopped them, they would have been charged with hit and run) but the person that they hit had to be taken to the hospital for treatment.
5. Infowars claims that "they beat up an older man and stole his gun"
See the original, objective descriptions of the videos, which have been moved around and added to. The only thing that I did not mention, was the protesters pointing their guns at the passenger in the truck, after he was likely making threats to them from inside his vehicle because he was ticked off at them for blocking traffic with their protest. They should not have done that.
Additions, after watching more videos that were not there before and others moved.
I also had to make some edits on the page above.
6. Apparently, the 2nd vehicle tried to run over 3 people and only 1 was injured badly enough to receive treatment at the hospital.
7. In a later video, we see that the older man, after being disarmed on the ground, NOT getting beat up or having been beat up at all. He is just being calmly held, even though he wants to leave....... until the cops get there because the cops were called............ON HIM.
8. The cops were called and in both situations that occurred during this one protesting event, from incidents that we witnessed ourselves on the videos, the so called infowars victims were the ones that justifiably had the cops called on them. I completely agree with this based on what we see with our own eyes. Other than the protesters pointing their guns at the enraged guy screaming at them inside his vehicle, what is it that the protesters did wrong? I've documented in my analysis all the things the inforwars victims did wrong. No arrests were made, however.
Hi metmike,
We both agree, this truck driver should have left. I don’t know if Oregon has a “stand your ground law”. if they do, this driver had the right to shoot, if I am not mistaken.
However, rather than focusing on the actions of this man, and that old man, what concerns me more is the decay of our society.
Since Floyd’s death, we have seen never-ending looting, burning, rioting, violence. The masses are getting used to it, as the new normal. The MSM ignores this problem, our new VP helps free the criminals, and the Speaker of the House encourages them to become even more violent.
So, now the mob wants to take their fight out into the suburbs. Now the mob stops cars and points their assault rifles into the drives’ faces. Don’t be surprised if we see more people running down protesters with their cars.
Unfortunately, our MSM promotes this insanity, by ignoring such things and giving us a slanted view of reality.
I know you don’t like infowars. However, I find it a necessary place of information….information the MSM hides from me.
Where else can I read about migrants burning down their detention centers in Greece, or attacking local farmers.
Where else can I read more about the collapsing border in the USA.
Where else can I read about French citizens slowly starting to rise against immigration policies. French churches are being destroyed and vandalized at record rates, while every 2 weeks a new mosque is being built.
Where else can I read about problems with Covid vaccinations in other countries, or our own.
Where else can I read about some of the dirty politics that go on in our country.
The MSM most certainly does not tell us any of these things..
"I don’t know if Oregon has a “stand your ground law”. if they do, this driver had the right to shoot, if I am not mistaken."
If you believe that Gunter, then you must also agree that when he parked his car, then went back to get his gun, came back out and went up to a protester(s) and pointed the gun in their face, that protester had the same right to shoot him.
Gunter,
I appreciate that Infowars sometimes gives you legit information that no other source will provide because its covered up by MSM. Welcome to my world on climate science/change.
But there's a huge difference.
The MSM and gatekeepers cover up and censor most of the truth about climate science. But I'm an atmospheric scientist that has access to all the authentic data and can objectively interpret that so that its ALWAYS, 100% the truth based on authentic science. I don't share anything here that is not backed up with actual data and compelling evidence......NEVER.
My agenda is to educate people about authentic, objective science by sharing 100%, unbiased facts.
Infowars has a massive political agenda and a long history of doing everything possible.... including using unethical tactics and lying to twist the meaning of everything so that the right always is right and always the victims or the hero's in every story and the left is always wrong and always the criminal or goats in every single story....no matter if they have to twist the facts into a pretzel to get it to come out that way.
Yes, they get some things right every once in a while but its the tiny minority. They have vast resources and can paint a picture to turn total bs into a very convincing story and you and other viewers/listeners can't possibly know when its bs and when its not...........especially when you/they go there frequently and you don't have other trusted sources giving you the left's or even the objective version to compare it with.
In today's political world, sadly, we have 2 opposite sides that for some sources, interpret situation so that it lines up favorable for their side, unfavorable for the other side. Often seen with hate and distrust of everybody from the other side.
You know me. I will do my best to be fair and will come down hard on either side when the facts show that it's bs.
That's why I'm glad that you bring their stuff here........even their bs. Give me a chance to comment on it.
Note that infowars has just shifted their video line up of the events around so that the top one, starts right after the car almost ran over 3 people, injuring 1 that went to the hospital for treatment.
The viewer going to infowars, is hit with the top 2 videos, that intentionally, start AFTER the incident triggering their strong reaction.
We see a bunch of enraged protestors screaming at the motorist, calling them names, attacking their vehicle........forcing them to stop the car.........but we don't know that this person almost ran over 3 people, one that had to go to the hospital and was trying to drive away. We are given the impression that the protesters acted this way UNPROVOKED which is intentional bs by infowars.
If you and me got into a fight and I punched you in the head first for no reason, then you retaliated but somebody played a video on youtube that started with you retaliating and titled it "Gunter attacks met mike!" Would that be an honest assessment?
But you want to focus too much on the fact that the protesters pointed a gun at the enraged guy in the truck cursing them out. I agree that was bad...............but a small part of the entire picture when we look at what he did later.
Surely we should be able to come up with plenty of incidents/videos of Antifa actually attacking people unprovoked because when you use incidents like this............where there is justification for most of their reactions and overall, they were more of the victims, not the criminals, what it does is weaken the credibility of the source and makes people like me feel the complete opposite.
When you try to frame a situation to unfairly condemn somebody/a group for stuff they didn't do, objective/fair minded people that know what you did will almost always side with the framed entity.
Does that make sense to you Gunter?
I'm not talking about people that ALWAYS think its antifa's fault, no matter what, which is probably most that go to infowars to hear the news the way they like it told. I'm talking about truly objective people that know what infowars did here.
It's who they are.
Their title:
More honest/objective titles:
Antifa and motorist clash after car hits 3 people and injures 1.
Or on the other incident
Antifa and upset motorist have confrontation with both pointing guns at each other.
I understand what you are saying. Thank you.
YW Gunter!
Gunter,
The bottom line is that Infowars wants you to hate these people.
Even after 3 of them got hit by a car and 1 injured in an unprovoked attack, we are supposed to think that they deserved it and are unjustified in any sort of response because when we hate certain people, they are always wrong and evil.
The reason that I welcome infowars stuff here is that people who go there, need to have a trusted place that can scrutinize and fact check their bs........or, if they have it right, verify that they have a good case.
Better to challenge them with the truth, then to let them push lies and hatred with impunity.
If you show me videos of riots from this group that are unprovoked and similar to many of them last Summer..............then I will be on your side and add a few pages of stuff to support it.
But these recent videos on this event from infowars is the quintessential example of them spreading hatred and intolerance by twisting the interpretation of what actually happened for their hate agenda.
I won't post a link from other sources stating the same thing that I just did because most of them are from the MSM and the left. I understand why you would not trust those sources because they have let us down so many times when it comes to being objective.
I'll continue to try to not be like that.
I don’t have any videos to prove any of the following… I read it in the LA Times, my local newspaper (which is a far-left leaning newspaper.)
Last year, in Beverly Hills, a group of Trump supporters held a peaceful trump rally… waving flags and Trump signs, etc.
Antifa people showed up and tried to physically attack the Trump supporters. Fortunately, the Beverly Police intervened.
At another time, not more than 5 miles from my home, a group of Proud Boys rode their motorcycles to a beer joint to have some beers.
Antifa found out, and they came and started a fight.
(Now, please don’t anyone call me a supporter of the Proud Boys. I didn’t even know this group had a chapter in our town. This group likes to start trouble too. I only wanted to point out that this group came for a peaceful gathering, on a Sunday afternoon, and Antifa showed up to start violence)
Furthermore, I have seen numerous video clips showing Antifa fighting violently with the police.
I would consider Antifa to be a violent “hate group”… and I didn’t get this idea from infowars.
You say, infowars is spreading violence and hate, with their commentaries.
Antifa is actually doing it physically.
And now they have become bold enough to march on the streets, carrying AR-15s
Antifa is a group that claims to be against fascism, but they act and dress like Mussolini's Fasci di Combattimento, the original fascists.
Antifa spreads violence and you (know this) Gunter.
When you show videos of them doing that for no reason(Antifa hurting people property without being provoked).....there are tons of them.....I will never defend them(Antifa).(I will always be on your side).
We should only use legit incidents like that, which are everywhere and not try to twist some incidents to be something they are not to make it look worse than it is because we hate that group.
TDS with our previous president did that in a way that you can truly appreciate.
In today's world, that seems almost impossible and for me to suggest people do that crazy.
But that's exactly what's wrong with our world right now.
Hating people that we disagree with or don't like....but not just a moderate brand of hate. Enough that it blinds us to objectively interpreting events when the hated group/people are featured.
Both sides do it and I spent a ton of time addressing it specifically, with me giving anti hate lectors, during the previous 4 years when the left did it here to Trump....when they spun facts to be anti Trump.
Alex Jones is one of the worlds biggest spreaders of hate and intolerance. Sorry, but I can't be anything but 100% honest with you.
I get that he lines up with your political philosophy and usually tells you stuff that the MSM will never tell you and its always extreme right stuff(which makes you drawn to him even more).
Is he making the world a better, more honest place?
Neither.
What he is doing, is engaging a bunch of republicans and getting them to hate the other side even more..................and making a huge amount of money by doing it, while increasing the political divide and MISunderstanding going on. The thing that is hurting our country the most is what he is selling to get rich.
Think about it. If we were all liberals, everybody would be happy in whatever world that would be.
If we were all conservatives, we would all be happy in that world.
The country would be united and people like Alex Jones would not exist in the first world and we wouldn't need them in the 2nd world.
He feeds on the divisiveness. The more divisive, the more people he attracts but they just don't see it that way because to them,. he is one of them. He is the only guy willing to fight the evil left and tell it like it is.
Thats the persona he sells. He's getting rich off of that.....by selling hate and divisiveness.
If he suddenly switched to being more objective and telling us to try to understand, at least some points the left is making or saying some positive things about the left or telling us when the right is stepping out of line or suggesting love instead of hate................his ratings would crash.
I was in the tv business for 11 years.
Ratings are EVERYTHING. They define profits.
Now I am spreading hate???? Because I don’t like organizations that set buildings on fire, throw Molotov cocktails at the police, turn life in our cities into chaos???
I know, I may have jumped to false conclusions with the videos presented by inforwars on that recent event.
But there are plenty of videos available to prove the comments above. No need to take up space for showing them again.
I also don’t like militias that parade around town, carrying AR15s, intimidating the People, be they the NFAC, the Proud Boys, or now Antifa.
There are plenty of countries where life is chaos and violence. It shouldn’t be like this in the USA
I am only an immigrant to this country, but I have feelings of "patriotism" for this country . I don't like what is gong on today. If this makes me a "spreader of hate", I rather fade silently into the night..
"Now I am spreading hate???? Because I don’t like organizations that set buildings on fire, throw Molotov cocktails at the police, turn life in our cities into chaos???"
Gunter, I'm so sorry that you think that. You have completely misinterpreted my previous post. Maybe it was the way that I communicated the message.
Please read it over again and cut and paste the part that accuses you of doing this.
The message was intended to support you for posting legit stuff about this group acting badly. I added the potion in ( ) to try to make it more clear.
Thanks
Maybe I need new glasses. I remember reading the first sentence of your post, saying "Antifa spreads violence and you Gunter". Well, in that case I need to apologize
One more comment, before I sign out for the night.
The local Portland news talks about this event. Apparently several people have called the police on the Antifa group. The local news only mentions one person being injured, and that is the truck driver. There was no mention of anyone being injured by a car running over them.
The truck driver is a disabled Marine. He is seriously injured
https://www.kptv.com/one-person-taken-to-the-hospital-after-crowd-blocks-traffic-in-north-portland/video_62a7a9f5-ea19-5c71-8a1e-a32df7af1efe.html
You read it corrrently but it was just me, like I often do when typing madly and not proof reading, missing 2 words that I have in the parenthesis now to make the sentence completely.
The first one, that you just repeated was an incomplete sentence. You realize that too, I'm sure.
I forgot to add the parenthesis after I fixed it.
The original incomplete sentence was
Antifa spreads violence and you Gunter.
I left out this:
Antifa spreads violence and you (know this) Gunter.
I make tons of mistakes typing and sometimes, a mistake like this can change the meaning of a sentence. If you read the rest of the epistle, you can see that I was not directing it at you but at Alex Jones.
I appreciate all of your posts and agree with them on Antifa's horrible behavior, basically almost every other time that I remember but this one.
So the biggest point of all here Gunter, regarding this issue, is that I agree with you strongly on this particular group based on hundreds of situations last Summer.
But if we want to convince others of their nefarious activity and very bad intentions, we need to use some of the many, many events that featured them being 100% the criminals and everybody else being the victims.
Sometimes, though its hard to believe THEY are actually the victims. Not very often but it happens. In those cases, the last thing we want to do is add an incident like that to the many legit cases of them doing harm while not being provoked.
Re: Re: Re: Re: now that we established new impeachment rules lets go get 'um
https://www.marketforum.com/forum/topic/65954/#66001
By metmike - Feb. 25, 2021, 11:32 a.m.
https://www.marketforum.com/forum/topic/65297/
it does seem quite odd that these events below, got coverage thats so different.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2020_United_States_racial_unrest
| 2020 United States racial unrest | ||||
|---|---|---|---|---|
.jpg)  .jpg) .jpg)   .png) Clockwise from top:
| ||||
| Date | May 8, 2020 – ongoing (7 months and 4 days) | |||
| Location |  United States | |||
| Caused by | Several deaths related to police activity, notably the killing of George Floyd while being arrested by the Minneapolis Police,[1]police brutality,[1]lack of police accountability,[1]inequality and racism[2] | |||
| Methods | Protests, demonstrations, riots, looting, civil disobedience, civil resistance, strike action | |||
| Status | Ongoing
| |||
| Concessions given |
| |||
| ||||
| Death(s) | at least 25[6] | |||
| Injuries | 400+ law enforcement officials and an unknown number of civilians[7] | |||
| Arrested | Over 14,000 (as of June 27, 2020)[5] | |||
| Damage | $1–2 billion insured damages (as of September 17, 2020)[8] | |||
This bears repeating:
| Casualties | |
|---|---|
| Death(s) | at least 25[6] |
| Injuries | 400+ law enforcement officials and an unknown number of civilians[7] |
| Arrested | Over 14,000 (as of June 27, 2020)[5] |
| Damage | $1–2 billion insured damages (as of September 17, 2020)[8] |
If a prosecutor was charging a criminal with 10 murders he would have plenty to convince the jury that this guy need the death penalty.
What if he decided to charge him with an 11th murder that he didn't commit, just to try to make him look even worse?
And the defense attorney proved that the prosecutor framed him intentionally on the 11th murder?
The prosecutors credibility would be shot and the murderer could get off because the jury, might then feel the prosecutor was out to get this guy, and not be seeking fair justice for just the real crimes.
For the record, Re: The Proud Boys. They actually don't start trouble, but ANTIFA has a babit of showing up where ever they do and starting trouble. The Proud Boys generally finish it and ANTIFA generally doesn't come out of it very well. But of course, as ANTIFA is doing the lords work, the press goes out of their way to attack the Proud Boys with manufactured nonsense. I think they've finally gievn up on the "Whute Supremecist" label as it's been pointed out many times that the Proud Boys are as diverse as the press could want.
