so lot of happening in EsMin as mercury/ sun double inferior conjunction along with new moon and VOC all in Action and 225/260 of circle is heavy for now-- BIG day can be near thnx giving
Thanks, fayq!
Everybody can express their views here on any topic.
However, when it doesn't conform to science, is not the truth or is fraudulent, I will push back, especially as a scientist that spend a year studying it extremely close in 1990(thanks to Iben Browning's fake earthquake prediction using it). I spent much of the year doing speaking engagements telling local residents that it was junk science.
Using astrology for anything, including the stock market is complete pseudo science. Take any 100 studies on this and the result is always the same.
Those that show Astrology is junk =100
Those that show Astrology, with its mystical power can predict things =0
There is a subset of situations where this can work. If you have enough people that believe and act on complete rubbish, the law of self-fulfilling prophesy's kicks in. The complete rubbish becomes THE indicator!
That law is driving the stock market to some extent but IT'S NOT BECAUSE THE PARTICIPANTS ARE FOLLOWING ASTROLOGY.
People that believe in Astrology could read 1 million studies that prove there is no relationship to science or value in predicting things but that makes 0 difference. Once we're truly convinced in something, human cognitive bias causes us to reject everything that contradicts that, including all the authentic facts. It causes us to twist realities so that they conform to what WE WANT TO BELIEVE.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astrology_and_science
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Is there some unknown, mystical force that scientists like me just don't understand?
That could be because we don't know everything.
However, if that was the case in Astrology, then it's track record with studies testing it, would not be ZERO providing solid evidence of it working and the rest of them (all of them) busting it and showing it to be worthless for making reliable predictions.
Other than if you had the majority of people believing in it in some realm, it would work because we know with certainty the ASTRONOMY science and can predict accurately where all the planets will be and when.
But the market is MUCH smarter than that. The Composite Man (from Wyckoff) which is the mentality of the entire market as it behaves and moves includes some really smart people that control trillions of dollars.
You can trust me on this one:
They are NOT using Astrology. People who use it like believing that they have unique knowledge in a mystical force which gives them an edge in seeing the future.
It's no better than flipping a coin. Your work here even shows that. I could have flipped a coin every day for the last year and used it to predict the stock market and been correct close to 50% of the time.
Do I have a magical mystery coin that predicts things?
Regardless, you are extremely welcome to show us your stuff. When it verifies and its based on Astrology, every single time that happens it will be based on the same thing that my coin toss is. Almost no exceptions.
When you dial in other indicators that have value.........then that has potential predictive power.
Again, please do generously share your stuff with us. I won't bash the Astrology like this every time.
Junk science, Astrology just needs a reality check from time to time:
By metmike - June 13, 2024, 6:10 p.m.
And if enough people were convinced that every time a dog pooped, it was a bullish indicator for stock market money flow.......it would work.
The impact of self fulfilling prophesies is for real. But Astrology's impact on the stock market is on par with dog pooping in the real world and especially the science world.
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Note the self fulfilling element to the post below:
By metmike - July 31, 2025, 4:39 p.m.
by Jennifer Nash, 7/16/25
The majority of people, who have money in the stock market want the market to go up and are biased, which might make it harder to completely accept that reality of an analysis like this. People don't want to read/hear that their investment is worth, let's say only half the REAL value of it as defined in an article like this.
My analysis here on the charts is to recognize that the actual value is the price at what people are willing to buy and sell it for, regardless of any other factors. In the end, that's the only thing that matters to investors and traders.
That's what makes or loses REAL money. Investors can identify the best stocks in the best industries that will do better than the overall market for sure but it still boils down to the phrase. "A rising tide will lift all boats".
Anybody fully invested in the stock market for any length of time has probably made a ton of money, even if they had to weather a few downside corrections that almost never last long.
The stock market is also a "self fulfilling prophesy".
https://philonotes.com/2024/12/robert-k-mertons-theory-of-the-self-fulfilling-prophecy
With the objective of being open minded and considering the chance that Astrology might in fact be a powerful force using a self fulfilling prophesy in enough people that follow junk science, I'm doing additional research.
https://finance.yahoo.com/news/stock-obsessed-gen-z-using-131900334.html
Hartzmark, the professor, says he doesn’t condone astrology and tarot as a day-trading strategy, but understands why people gravitate toward it.
“The illusion of control,” he said. “Financial decisions are complicated and scary.”
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https://www.thecut.com/article/using-astrology-for-trading-stock-market.html
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https://medium.com/@astrobabag/how-people-use-astrology-to-invest-in-the-stock-market-b99e9936600b
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I already was extremely familiar with how this works. I just can't help rolling my eyes over how nonsensical the principles are that are used for defining the guidance used by Astrologists.
Maybe the younger people they refer to have lost their ability to use critical thinking because of the internet telling them what to think/believe all day and there's so many know nothings trading nonsense in 2025, that they are part of Wyckoffs Composite Man???
I highly doubt it but it's possible in today's world.
MM,
Is fayqq promoting astrology or astronomy? Not that I subscribe to either but is that a distinction worth noting? I kind of recall all the planets aligning coinciding with (not causing) the '87 crash. Not my cup of tea, but that got a lot of people following the planets and moon.
so typical way to use how to use as other indicator -- 6790--6525 a good size move and charts shared by solmon
so typical way to use how to use as other indicator -- 6790--6525 a good size move and charts shared by solmon
joj,
I'd glad you brought that up.
I assumed that everybody knows the difference but since you're extraordinarily bright, that's not so. Probably my own expertise in that particular field is causing some biased assumptions in others of what's so obvious for me. I do know millions of people think that astrology works, so for sure it must be so.
So let's learn more.
https://aas.org/faq/whats-difference-between-astronomy-and-astrology
Astronomy is a science that studies everything outside of the earth's atmosphere, such as planets, stars, asteroids, galaxies; and the properties and relationships of those celestial bodies. Astronomers base their studies on research and observation. Astrology, on the other hand, is the belief that the positioning of the stars and planets affect the way events occur on earth.
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I found this bright lady's definition below to be the best!
Written by Kate Howells
Public Education Specialist, The Planetary Society
May 1, 2024
https://www.planetary.org/articles/what-is-the-difference-between-astronomy-and-astrology
The terms “astronomy” and “astrology” are sometimes mixed up, but they actually mean very different things. While they both deal with planets and other celestial objects, astronomy is a scientific discipline, whereas astrology is a divinatory belief system.
Astronomy is the field of science that studies objects and phenomena in space. Astronomers apply physics, mathematics, and chemistry to explain the origins and behaviors of planets, moons, stars, nebulae, galaxies, and other celestial bodies, as well as the Universe as a whole.
Astrology, on the other hand, is a divinatory practice based on the belief that the movements and relative positions of celestial bodies — particularly the Moon, Sun, and planets of the Solar System — can influence people and events. Although astrology involves real celestial objects, constellations of stars that can be seen in the night sky, and known phenomena such as apparent retrograde motion, astrology has no scientific basis and is considered a pseudoscience.
I kind of recall all the planets aligning coinciding with (not causing) the '87 crash.
Excellent point for why so many people believe in this nonsense and your verbiage.
Like you said, it did not cause the crash but you remember the coincidence of the 2 events. This is exactly what keeps believers, believing. COINCIDENCE.
They remember only the coincidences and forget the longer list of no coincidences.
When famous people would die, if 3 of them died in a short period, my wife used to say "everything happens in 3's!!!" This was so etched in her brain from childhood that she would debate me about it being factual. I would tell her that she only remembers the exceptional times when 3 celebrities died in a few days and never paid attention when only 2 of them died or, like most of the time when only 1 of them died.
So, after years of her saying "everything happens in 3s" after every time that happened, for fun, when a famous person would die, I would say "everything happens in 1's" if it was 2 in a week, I might say "everything happens in 2's" After a couple of years of me saying this 100+ times, she got the point and stopped saying "everything happens in 3s"
That's how astrology works in people that conveniently only remember the things that confirm what they want to believe and forget everything else. It's actually how most human beings think in most other realms too. Cognitive or Confirmation bias.
It actually makes sense to have this bias. If your brain defines the truth or defines a known principle as X+Y =Z, then that happens, to your brain that was an authentic truth. When X+Y turns out to be A, then your brain rejects it because, by definition of your brain's truth/laws that was false.
This bias can be so bad in fields like politics that X+Y =A can happen 20 times in a row but the person who believes X+Y =Z will reject that. Their brain sees 1+1=2 as wrong. It's as if you can show them 1 apple and 1 orange and count them =2, they still can't see it because their brain defines 1+1 = some other number.
I'll avoid some real world political examples that you know about which are quintessential examples of this.
In math, physics and the hard sciences, it's easy to bust this.
However, in politics and realms that involve opinions or non scientific beliefs it's virtually impossible to convince a believer to change their minds.
Their brains have been programmed to reject things that contradict the belief system by definition of the belief system.
This is why the belief in Astrology is impossible to change in most people. You can never prove it wrong when they only remember the times that it was right.
On this cognitive bias.
Everybody has it, especially me. Not being aware of it, is exactly how it impacts us the most.
We must fact check, not just those things that we think are wrong but also those things that we think are right.
For instance, in this thread, from the get go I know that Astrology is bunk and no way that it could be having a major impact on the stock market.
But then, I had to go back and fact check that because of the law of self fulfilling prophesies that can cause realms to do things that don't make sense, other than people believing in things that don't make sense and their actions that don't make sense, if there are enough of them acting in unison like Wyckoffs composite man in the markets can actually have an impact that doesn't make sense based on fundamental principles that SHOULD be driving the markets.
mcfarm will sometimes say some crazy things that I KNOW are wrong. But every time I assume that, I also fact check it.
Low and behold there have been NUMEROUS times that he was right and I just learned something and it was BEFORE I responded, which avoided me saying something wrong in response.
Being a moderator here has caused me to be OCD about fact checking myself, knowing that people will be reading it. The non moderator metmike, like everybody else would never do that.
It has been humbling in some ways and also greatly helps to understand why other people think like they do because sometimes they are right and I am wrong and the only way to know when those times are, is to assume each time that I might be the one who is wrong.
That's also the mentality that one should have when using the scientific method.
