earlier somebody posted about how the Steel Tariffs were pushing US steel to invest 750 million worth of modernization into a Gary Indiana Steel plant these investments will help production but not result in any more jobs at the plant. but the investment in the plant will be welcome, the problem is that it comes with a cost as is always the case with Tariffs.
The Ironic thing is this cost is being leveled by another Company in the Steel Industry.
Kind of like the government is in the business of picking winners and losers.
take away is this company will not invest the 600 million in plants and could lead to 1200 workers being laid off at this company alone and many many more at the companies the make their steel for.
I guess the TT are correct Tariffs are good and trade wars are easy to win.
I have always wondered why Trump is all up in arms about Steel and never mentioned The Garment manufacturing and apparel industry and Industry that lost almost 10X as many jobs as the Steel Industry.
it couldn't be the fact that his daughter was having apparel made In China and that raising the price of Steel by 25% would increase the value of all of trumps commercial real estate holdings.
Was the real objective all along to Make Trump solvent again ?
From the article:
"March 9, 2018 / 3:55 PM / 6 months ago"
Since this speculative article was written almost 6 months ago, we have to ask "With 6 months of data behind us since then, is this speculative scenario actually playing out?"
If so, then let's see the evidence, if not then WHEN will it happen?
If that can't be stated.............then, it's being busted.......or it just becomes one of those disastrous predictions that never happens but the time frame just keeps getting extended.
where do you come up with 6 months of data the tariffs have only been in place for short of a couple of months.
seems one agenda is showing - when one wants to make and argument on one hand that its to early to tell if a wildly fluctuating export report should carry and weight buta business has to decide in the same one month period whether to lay people of or not or the story is invalid.
Republic Steel invested in their plant in Ohio....AND they are hiring. I'll bet they pay more than McDonalds too....all because of tariffs.
If you Google it you will see it is happening across the US. Get your head out of the sand. Sending billions to China every year does NOT benefit the US.
"where do you come up with 6 months of data the tariffs have only been in place for short of a couple of months.
"seems one agenda is showing - when one wants to make and argument on one hand that its to early to tell if a wildly fluctuating export report should carry and weight buta business has to decide in the same one month period whether to lay people of or not or the story is invalid."
You are right.........one's agenda IS showing.
I am not saying anything other than for you or your source to define your claim in terms of when or how it will happen vs unsubstantiated speculation with an open ended time frame.
Jim has nicely provided authentic evidence of actually hiring in that industry.............in less than 6 months.
I am not saying 6 months is enough time. You tell me when. 9 months? A year?
If you don't know. I understand.
It just means.............you don't know.
I am saying that I don't know. You are presenting a case that you do know. So I would just like the evidence......so that I will know too.
Just google AK Steel jobs. This company is hiring.
and even in that Industry there are winners and losers
No lets look at other occupations
Farmers beans were trading somewhere north of 10.25 when China announced that if tariffs were put on exports from China they would put them on Soybeans and now they are nearly $2.00 lower thats 9 billion lost out of the US economy and nearly $50,K on my personal income that I will not be spending on a new US built Pickup or US built lawn tractor.
Trump picked Steel as the winner and the rest of us have to pay for that so my spending along with the spending of some 2 million farmers will get cut by somewhere near 10 billion for some 500 steel workers jobs those are some very expensive jobs
To say it can't be stated as stats is a bit misleading
I did a bit of research, of the industry and the disruption caused by the tarrifs
I don't profess to be anything close to an expert but since nobody else offered anything in the way of stats in the post seemed a bit confusing to say the least
Since Canada is wrapped up in this 25% tariff which to my knowledge has done nothing or very little to increase the production of raw material. what is the benefit
Sure, some plants open to roll out slabs of steel, but where is the raw product and who will invest in such a risky environment to any substantial amount
NLMK, a leading producer of hot and cold rolled steel in 3 USA plants is applying for relief from the 25% tariff, as I understand it
[Not sure about cold rolled steel production]
As some may know rolled steel is produced from iron slabs, the common weight is 25 tons. I have never measured a slab of steel but they are commonly delivered by flat bed truck and possibly train but the only slabs I have seen are by truck delivery and at the opposite end trucks deliver the finished rolled steel
Be careful how you load them or they can tip over. That is called a "suicide load" but some idiot plants want them delivered as suicide loads thus you take care
{ I hade one suicide load tip over but luckily a tow truck rescued me with no damage. I went around an "on ramp" too fast and there she went]] Just a note to not get impatient with a slow truck ahead of you or you could get squished unless the driver takes it slow and easy, until straightened out
Also cutting in between trucks in stop and go traffic is a recipe for your car to be squished as the truck will eventually decrease the space between trucks and if you are in between, that is called the "suicide gap"
One trucker coming out of Ca heading to northern climate in winter with fresh produce, got on his radio and claimed if he let any more 4 wheelers in front of him he would be back at the loading dock in no time
I have had cars cut in front of me, many times, so close I can not see the tail lights over my front hood. You probably don't know that is what happens, when you "shoot the gap" between trucks. What do you think happens when your brake lights come on and I can't see them because you squezzed yourself in between me and the truck ahead
Todays narrow, sloped hoods help some but there is still a limit.
I can talk to the truck ahead by radio and know when a "brake check" is coming [stop] but where is your radio?? Just a bit of trucker lingo and your safety vs our knowledge of traffic patterns, even if we don't see it, we know what is happening. Can you see what is happening until you see brake lights??
And please do not ride your brake pedal as that causes of and on brake lights which is a cluster f@#$ in the making.
Anyway back to steel
Seems the problem is production of enough of the domestic slabs, which I know for a fact is a problem
The producers of raw steel want the domestic market but don't produce enough slabs or enough of the different slabs required, thus the story gets a bit misleading
I know one user of steel slabs that can use the entire production of one mill, but nobody is making any great plans or investment to increase production of raw material. Perhaps some re-opening of out dated production mills, due to increases in price, which has gone through the roof. Wages seem to be in the 27/hr vicinity
[I think an increase of domestic price from maybe $300 plus/ton to over $900/ton. Somebody should re-check those prices as it has been some time since I saw a price listing]
The last major steel foundry in America [as I understand it] was demolished for scrap steel
I can remember what used to look like family owned foundries located along rivers and glowing red hot in the night as I drove past in my 18 wheeler
I am not out there any more so I can't actually say what happened, but slab production is a real problem as I stated before. That statement comes from very close sources within the industry
[We pay the 25% in Canada
I don't know if the steel foundries in Hamilton, Ont. still operate or not??] I can remember lake boats unloading iron ore in Hamilton and Hamilton was a steel town. Today??? Perhaps some rolled steel but slabs, I don't know
NLMK had record earnings last yr. but from what I can see, most of it came from outside the USA in Europe etc. If I am looking at the correct stock, the share value has tumbled down but the July 2018 board meeting did recommend a dividend of $5.00 plus at the last board meeting and is owned by Russia, a huge world wide producer of iron ore pellets amongst other products, with 3 plants, producing rolled steel in the USA
So far, NLMK has the support of both sides of the aisles for tarrif waivers but the steel producers have lobbied against waivers, thus the continued existence of jobs is uncertain. Will customers continue to buy or will they be able to find a cheaper source of slabs or finished rolled steel
I doubt anybody will be building production facilities for slab production [JMHO] as that part of the industry is high capital intensive, markets are uncertain for volume of different specs, and who can say when the trade war is over and done. Where does that leave you?? Will your billion dollar plant and no subsidies, be profitable, in an uncertain market place?? What happens if India, which has existing production facilities, produces slab product for less and your slab steel production dollars went bye bye
Some steel producers don't even produce enough slab material, the correct spec etc, but lobby against waivers
Some plants in India, I think they are competitive with volume and price even with a 25% tariff, which would give pause to a billion dollar domestic plant investment but I would recommend somebody do some research on what kind of domestic plant openings are happening, the scale of size, technology etc. and to disprove or other wise my statement
If anybody can add or correct me please do so, as most slab producers either do not return phone calls, do not produce the required slab material required such as special slab material for stainless steel in enough quantity or????
Stats are important and I have tried my best to produce some stats and personal knowledge on the steel industry
Please think about your personal road safety also, as I got a bit side tracked, a bit, as old memories came back, as I used to haul steel rolls and wire, but now I farm which I like much better.